[[Category:1977 - Lectures, Conversations and Letters]]
[[Category:1977-01 - Lectures, Conversations and Letters]]
[[Category:Conversations - India]]
[[Category:Conversations - India, Bhuvanesvara]]
[[Category:Lectures, Conversations and Letters - India]]
[[Category:Lectures, Conversations and Letters - India, Bhuvanesvara]]
[[Category:Audio Files 10.01 to 20.00 Minutes]]
[[Category:1977 - New Audio - Released in July 2012]]
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Prabhupāda: [break] ... and European temples, Deity worship, kīrtana. It will go on increasing, more and more centers. And make such a policy-pickpocket $250 and give them books. $250 for an American is nothing. Is it not?
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Hari-śauri: Not very much.
Prabhupāda: Not at all! Any common man can pay $250-once. Not that we are getting every month or every few year. Once 250 even ordinary worker can pay.
<div class="code">770129R1-BHUVANESVARA - January 29, 1977 - 12:27 Minutes</div>
Hari-śauri: Yes. They do like that with those sets of books.
Hari-śauri: Most things are done in America are on credit.
Satsvarūpa: "Book of the Month Club," they have. Very popular.
Prabhupāda: Lead a gentle life. We don't allow divorce. Is that not good? Where is that check?
Prabhupāda: So you... We have to organize like that. And actually this is greater valuable for their life, changing life.
Hari-śauri: Two checks. There was two checks for a hundred and ten. That went to Calcutta without Abhirāma.
Hari-śauri: Yes. These book clubs are very big.
Prabhupāda: Oh, that check. And another check?
Prabhupāda: So now you all GBC make a plan how to introduce the books in every home. The same policy in other languages also. America is English language. Similarly, we can do here also in Hindi language, in Oriya language, or in Europe. So we have got much work ahead. Don't think our business is finished. No. Simply very intelligent we have to do it.
Hari-śauri: And that other check went with Rāmeśvara to Bombay.
Hari-śauri: Practically speaking, we've hardly got any books translated into any other languages except for English.
Prabhupāda: Hmm.
Prabhupāda: No. We shall gradually do. When the English language there, from English you can do any language.
Satsvarūpa: One of their arguments is that they'll get some member and deprogram him, some weak devotee, and then he will go to court or he will write and he'll say: "Yes. I did not want to join this movement, but they did something to me, and I lost my free will, and then . . ."
Hari-śauri: Yes. There's unlimited field.
Prabhupāda: They have said like that?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Sanskrit is very difficult. But when I have given in English language, you can convert into any other. English is known everywhere. This is international. So far I have seen—I've traveled all over the world—English language is understood. Sometimes they purposefully avoid. Otherwise, they understand. I have seen in Germany. They understand English, but they hate talking.
Satsvarūpa: Yes. They tell so many lies. They say that the devotee looked into his eyes, and suddenly he couldn't think anymore.
Satsvarūpa: In France, too. In France they don't speak English.
Prabhupāda: ''Ācchā''?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Satsvarūpa: That's what Ādi-keśava is being charged with—mind control.
Satsvarūpa: They don't want to.
Pradyumna: Like ''asi-kāraṇa''. Like mind control, hypnotism.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There is agitation in Canada.
Prabhupāda: So why not let me control your mind? I'll control your mind—the judge. (someone enters) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hmm? No, no. No, no. Let him come. Why? Call him.
Satsvarūpa: Yes, Quebec.
Satsvarūpa: It's all right. He can come.
Prabhupāda: Just like here it happened, Hindi and English. That enviousness is always there. I have seen in Montreal. All the officers, they are speaking in French. They won't talk in English. Airport. Purposefully. And there was fight, regular fight between these French speaking and English speaking, riot. People are so foolish. So it is bilingual. In everything, English and French. If you put one notice, it must be in English and French, as here (chuckling) they in the provincial language, Oriya, and Hindi, state language, and English for outsiders-three languages. You'll see in the railway station the local language and the Hindi language and English. Actually people take advantage of the English language and little more from the Hindi. Local language nobody knows. Just like we do not know what is Oriya.
Prabhupāda: They should not say like that. Ask. (converses in Bengali with Indian man) (break)
Hari-śauri: (laughing) The people who speak the local language can't read it. So the signs are useless. Anybody who is educated enough to read it can read...
Satsvarūpa: They should speak their mind to you about this.
Prabhupāda: English language understood. English... They speak in English. In big, big cities like Bombay, Calcutta, Delhi, even the girls, young girls, they would like to speak in English. They don't like to speak in their... At home even, with their father and mother, they're speaking in English. Especially in Bombay, everyone speaks. Not now. I have connection with Bombay since 1927. In 1927 I first went to Bombay. So how many years? Fifty years? I have seen it. They speak in English. They are sending their children where education is given by medium, English. High-class men, they send their children to learn through medium of English. There is Calcutta, St. Julia's College, near our college near our temple.
Prabhupāda: No, you talk amongst yourselves everything. And you are all GBC. Tell, "This is not good." They should have ''kīrtana ''here. They should go to the city, ''kīrtana ''party. People should know that there is . . . something is going to be done. Actually they want to enjoy that sea-bathing. They're going here and there. That is their business. That is not preaching, that is sense enjoyment. ''Pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi grāma ''(CB Antya-khaṇḍa 4.126). That is the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Why there should be discrimination, "Not here, not there"? He wants in every village and every town. How you can discriminate? Wherever possible, you should start.
Satsvarūpa: Hindu College?
Satsvarūpa: How is all the money for construction for this temple supposed to come? By the local preaching by Gaura-Govinda or . . .
Prabhupāda: No. St. Julia's. All Indian students, all very rich man's sons. I sent my sons to English, St. Mary's High School and St. Teresa's school. Learned English very nicely. Scottish Churches College. I was educated in Scottish... All our professors European, Englishmen and Scotsmen.
Prabhupāda: Somehow or other, it must come. He has promised that he will collect half.
Satsvarūpa: I think you wrote somewhere that Sanskrit should be the national...
Satsvarūpa: That's right. And whatever he collects, you said you would . . .
Prabhupāda: That is very difficult. No, I... They wanted to make a national language. There was fight, great fight. Therefore I suggested, "Why not make Sanskrit language?" Everyone will adore.
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Satsvarūpa: Because English is the language of the invaders; Sanskrit...
Satsvarūpa: I heard that he was told whatever he collects you would match that or match half of it.
Prabhupāda: Yes. I have no objection, English. But if they wanted that national language, why not take Sanskrit? I am international. I don't believe in this national or statewise. I never believed. This is very good idea, īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam [[ISO mantra 1]] . God is the proprietor. He is the original father. Ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā [[ISO mantra 1]] . Why do they not take this philosophy? They have attempted this United Nation organization. And where is the philosophy how to make one state? That is cheating them. Why not make one state?
Prabhupāda: Hmm, hmm, hmm. Gargamuni may go and organize in Dacca. That will be a great service. He was speaking of going to Dacca. That will be greater service.
Hari-śauri: They actually don't desire that.
Satsvarūpa: I thought they were mostly going for the library work.
Prabhupāda: No.
Prabhupāda: Whatever . . . no, he says there is possible, that Gauḍīya Maṭha. If in Pakistan, in Bangladesh, if he can organize one center, it will be great triumph.
Hari-śauri: They can speak, "United Nations," but...
Satsvarūpa: Dacca.
Prabhupāda: The barking, dog's bark. Otherwise, what... They do not attempt it. Why not make one state—the whole world? Keep the democracy, but make one state, "United States of the World." Why "United States of America"? Make English language common language and "United States of the World." If they organize, they can do it. Just like United States has included Hawaii. They are not actually of the same blood. They are not European. So how they are managing Hawaii? Hawaii is a different stock. It is from Chinese.
Prabhupāda: ''Kīrtana ''and ''prasāda ''distribution. This is our preaching mainly. And if they hear little philosophy, that is very good. Otherwise simply ''kīrtana ''and ''prasāda ''distribution is sufficient. Caitanya Mahāprabhu used to do that. He was not speaking philosophy to everyone. ''Kīrtana ''and ''prasāda ''distribution. So our men can perform very nice ''kīrtana'', and if they come to take little ''prasādam'', that is preaching. You have to maintain this standard, that ''kīrtana ''must go on and ''prasādam ''should be distributed.
Hari-śauri: Polynesian actually.
Satsvarūpa: And take collection for that, to continue that.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is actually a type of Chinese people. That, our Bali-mardana's wife, belongs to that stock. But in order to elevate her she represents that "I belong to the Japanese." (laughs) but I have studied. She belongs to that Hawaii. Maybe her father or somebody was respectable or rich man in that Hawaii, but she does not belong to Japan. She is that Hawaiian-Chinese stock. So the United States, they have included this and going on nice. Their position is now secure. Nobody can invade. The Japanese tried to invade Pearl Harbor. Then finished. Atom bomb. The atom bomb was dropped on account of their attempt to invade this Pearl Harbor. In Honolulu there is Pearl Harbor.
Prabhupāda: Yes. By selling books, by contribution, somehow or other maintain. Everywhere.
Hari-śauri: Yeah. They would never have entered the war unless... They weren't going to enter the war...
Satsvarūpa: Our movement has changed in America in the past six years or so. Now devotees are not much seen on the streets chanting. So there's different feelings. Some say it is all right, because everyone is now distributing books more.
Prabhupāda: These poor Japanese, in two, three wars they attempted to expand. They are very poor in their land. Practically they have no place, very poor. Only by some technical knowledge they are maintaining. Otherwise they have no food, no shelter. Very poor country. I have studied. The Dai Nippon directors, they are living in a thatched house. And their system is: big company, they supply everything—food, cloth, medicine, children's education, and little salary. So people do not leave the post.
Prabhupāda: That is also nice.
Hari-śauri: Yes. Because their whole life is there.
Satsvarūpa: That's also a kind of ''kīrtana''. But then the public, they hardly ever see us anymore. They used to say: "Oh, the saffron-robed people chanting on the streets."
Prabhupāda: They are not independent. Fully dependent on the employer. So they give poor salary. Dai Nippon has their own hospital, own education, and everything, big industry. And little salary, that's all. So whatever house they allot, they have to accept. And I have seen the director living in a cottage like this almost. So Japanese actually they are poor. Only the capitalists, they have got... Therefore their yen value... You go to purchase—"Two thousand yen." You'll be surprised, "So much paying!" But it has no value. "One million yen." (laughs) In the beginning I... "What is this nonsense? So much?"
Prabhupāda: But they come to the love feast.
Hari-śauri: Our devotees, Gurukṛpā's party, they're talking about they collect a hundred thousand, eighty thousand, but it means, that means...
Satsvarūpa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: It means few dollars.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Hari-śauri: Yes. Three or four hundred dollars.
Satsvarūpa: Yes. It's not necessary to emphasize that street chanting.
Prabhupāda: In taxi in the beginning, I saw, "Three hund..., three thousand dollar." So (laughs)... And "Three thousand yen." So I did not know. I have got... They changed. Not dishonest. Honest or dishonest, I did not know. Whatever they took and returned, that's all. But I know they are not dishonest. They are nice people, hard worker, honest. But Japanese... This Tojo attempted that "This is the time for expanding with German help." Bad luck. They could not do. They wanted to keep China under their control. That also failed. They fought with the Russians in the beginning, when we were children, to expand-failed. This time they wanted to occupy Hawaii.
Prabhupāda: No. Sell books and invite them to come to temple for love feast. (pause)
Hari-śauri: They had many, many islands. They took a lot. But gradually the Americans won them all back.
Satsvarūpa: And there is all these men. It's still five more days before the ceremony. If they can do this . . . programs locally.
Prabhupāda: Now they are migrating. In Hawaii there are many Japanese. Many Japanese.
Prabhupāda: Yes. They should go to the . . . yes, locally. ''Kīrtana ''party. They should go in their bus and have in the city ''kīrtana ''party. Try to collect something. (end)
Hari-śauri: They're very much wanted in other countries as well. They're technicians.
Prabhupāda: So if you can educate people, they will be united. This is actually united nations movement. Actually see how these Europeans, Americans, and Africans, and others, without any artificial allurement, how we are keeping together. Nobody is dissatisfied with humble eating, humble living, humbly, plain living. So it is possible. There is possibility. We live simple life, high thinking-United Nation. We can possibly... And there will be no scarcity. If we live simple life with Kṛṣṇa conscious thinking, There will be no scarcity.
Hari-śauri: Just like India has so many villages. Because they are living simply, then there's enough for everyone.
Prabhupāda: No scarcity. Population increasing? You increase your food. So much land everywhere vacant, all over the world. But that they will not do. They will keep the cattles and eat. Cattle also, they want vegetables. Otherwise where you'll get cattle? But therefore in Bhagavad-gītā, annād bhavanti bhūtāni [[BG 3.14]] . Produce food grains. Just like this is. How nice it is, from paddy. So you take the paddies, rice, eat, and the grass you can utilize in so many ways. Anywhere you can till the ground, you get paddy and the grass. Make your cottage. So shelter is there. And the animals also like this grass. You can make home. Where is the scarcity? Plain living, high thinking, and prepare for next life. Go back home, back to Godhead. Finish this hellish life of repeated birth and death. There is no knowledge. And when we try to give them this knowledge, they say, "You are brainwashed. You have imported some new way of life, style of life. Brainwash." So our European, American devotees, they like rice? No.
Hari-śauri: Yes.
Prabhupāda: In this country rice is staple. Orissa, Bengal, Bihar. They take more rice.
Hari-śauri: Yes, big amount of rice, small sabji.
Prabhupāda: Japan also, same thing like Bengal and Orissa. They take rice and fish. That is their staple.
Hari-śauri: In the West they regard rice as the poor man's food.
Prabhupāda: But Japanese are very intelligent, Bengalis are intelligent, by taking fish and rice. In Bengal ninety percent people, they take fish. Here also, Orissa, cent percent, even the Jagannātha pūjārīs. In Bihar also, fifty percent. The more you go towards Western part of India, you get more wealthy province, just like Uttar Pradesh, very wealthy province, enlightened. All the big cities are there: Allahabad, Kanpur, Agra, Lucknow. Every hundred miles you get a very nice city in UP, the best province in India. All the holy places-Vṛndāvana, Prayāga, Hardwar, Ayodhyā, many celebrated holy places. Ganges and Yamunā flowing, two sacred rivers. Both of them through in Uttar Pradesh. And all the cities are either on the bank of the Yamunā or Ganges. And that is the best province, state, in India. It has got fifty districts. And fifty districts means fifty towns. Little more or less important. But the Kanpur is the third important city in India. First Calcutta, Bombay, and next, Kanpur.
Satsvarūpa: Not Delhi?
Prabhupāda: No. Delhi has become important on account of capital.
Satsvarūpa: Politics.
Prabhupāda: Government.
Satsvarūpa: International government.
Prabhupāda: From business point... Now they're making Delhi industrially developed. That is new attempt. But Calcutta, Bombay, Kanpur is old... Calcutta is manufactured by the British. Bombay also manufactured. But Kanpur is older, very old. Kanyakubja. That Ajāmila upākhyāna ?(?) Ajāmila?
Hari-śauri: Ajāmila.
Prabhupāda: Ajāmila story, that was in Kanpur. Very, very old city. Kanpur, Mathurā, they are very old cities. Allahabad, Prayāga. Prehistoric. Manipur. (end)
770129R1-BHUVANESVARA - January 29, 1977 - 12:27 Minutes
Prabhupāda: Lead a gentle life. We don't allow divorce. Is that not good? Where is that check?
Hari-śauri: Two checks. There was two checks for a hundred and ten. That went to Calcutta without Abhirāma.
Prabhupāda: Oh, that check. And another check?
Hari-śauri: And that other check went with Rāmeśvara to Bombay.
Prabhupāda: Hmm.
Satsvarūpa: One of their arguments is that they'll get some member and deprogram him, some weak devotee, and then he will go to court or he will write and he'll say: "Yes. I did not want to join this movement, but they did something to me, and I lost my free will, and then . . ."
Prabhupāda: They have said like that?
Satsvarūpa: Yes. They tell so many lies. They say that the devotee looked into his eyes, and suddenly he couldn't think anymore.
Prabhupāda: Ācchā?
Satsvarūpa: That's what Ādi-keśava is being charged with—mind control.
Pradyumna: Like asi-kāraṇa. Like mind control, hypnotism.
Prabhupāda: So why not let me control your mind? I'll control your mind—the judge. (someone enters) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hmm? No, no. No, no. Let him come. Why? Call him.
Satsvarūpa: It's all right. He can come.
Prabhupāda: They should not say like that. Ask. (converses in Bengali with Indian man) (break)
Satsvarūpa: They should speak their mind to you about this.
Prabhupāda: No, you talk amongst yourselves everything. And you are all GBC. Tell, "This is not good." They should have kīrtana here. They should go to the city, kīrtana party. People should know that there is . . . something is going to be done. Actually they want to enjoy that sea-bathing. They're going here and there. That is their business. That is not preaching, that is sense enjoyment. Pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi grāma (CB Antya-khaṇḍa 4.126). That is the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Why there should be discrimination, "Not here, not there"? He wants in every village and every town. How you can discriminate? Wherever possible, you should start.
Satsvarūpa: How is all the money for construction for this temple supposed to come? By the local preaching by Gaura-Govinda or . . .
Prabhupāda: Somehow or other, it must come. He has promised that he will collect half.
Satsvarūpa: That's right. And whatever he collects, you said you would . . .
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Satsvarūpa: I heard that he was told whatever he collects you would match that or match half of it.
Prabhupāda: Hmm, hmm, hmm. Gargamuni may go and organize in Dacca. That will be a great service. He was speaking of going to Dacca. That will be greater service.
Satsvarūpa: I thought they were mostly going for the library work.
Prabhupāda: Whatever . . . no, he says there is possible, that Gauḍīya Maṭha. If in Pakistan, in Bangladesh, if he can organize one center, it will be great triumph.
Satsvarūpa: Dacca.
Prabhupāda: Kīrtana and prasāda distribution. This is our preaching mainly. And if they hear little philosophy, that is very good. Otherwise simply kīrtana and prasāda distribution is sufficient. Caitanya Mahāprabhu used to do that. He was not speaking philosophy to everyone. Kīrtana and prasāda distribution. So our men can perform very nice kīrtana, and if they come to take little prasādam, that is preaching. You have to maintain this standard, that kīrtana must go on and prasādam should be distributed.
Satsvarūpa: And take collection for that, to continue that.
Prabhupāda: Yes. By selling books, by contribution, somehow or other maintain. Everywhere.
Satsvarūpa: Our movement has changed in America in the past six years or so. Now devotees are not much seen on the streets chanting. So there's different feelings. Some say it is all right, because everyone is now distributing books more.
Prabhupāda: That is also nice.
Satsvarūpa: That's also a kind of kīrtana. But then the public, they hardly ever see us anymore. They used to say: "Oh, the saffron-robed people chanting on the streets."
Prabhupāda: But they come to the love feast.
Satsvarūpa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Satsvarūpa: Yes. It's not necessary to emphasize that street chanting.
Prabhupāda: No. Sell books and invite them to come to temple for love feast. (pause)
Satsvarūpa: And there is all these men. It's still five more days before the ceremony. If they can do this . . . programs locally.
Prabhupāda: Yes. They should go to the . . . yes, locally. Kīrtana party. They should go in their bus and have in the city kīrtana party. Try to collect something. (end)
