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710808 - Lecture - London

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His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada



710808LE-LONDON - August 05, 1971 - 49:57 Minutes



Devotee: (introducing tape) Lunch engagement, 8th August, London.

Prabhupāda:

Svarṇāśramācāravatā
puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān
viṣṇur ārādhyate panthā
nānyat tat-toṣa-kāraṇam
(Viṣṇu Purāṇa 3.8.9)

In the Viṣṇu Purāṇa there is a statement that a person who is executing properly the rules and regulation of varṇa and āśrama . . . according to the Vedic system, there are four varṇas.

(aside) Yes, you can close it.

Four social order and four spiritual order. Brahmin, kṣatriya, vaiśya and śūdra, this is social order.

And brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa, spiritual orders. Āśrama, brahmacārya āśrama. Āśrama means cultivation of spiritual life in a suitable position. One may remain a brahmacārī or he become a gṛhastha, householder, living with wife, children, family. Then vānaprastha, then sannyāsa.

So all these processes are meant for pleasing Viṣṇu, Lord Viṣṇu. Varṇāśramācāravatā. By executing this varṇāśrama system one can please the Supreme Personality of Viṣṇu. And nānyat tat-toṣa-kāraṇam: He is very much pleased (by) one who executes all.

And by pleasing Viṣṇu, one can immediately become liberated. There are different processes of liberation: severe austerity, penances, practice of yoga, and many other processes. But if we can please Lord Viṣṇu, then liberation can be immediately attained, even in this life. This is the śāstric injunction.

Unfortunately, people do not know what is the Supreme. There is no education. Viṣṇu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Viṣṇu has got many forms, dīpārcir eva hi daśāntaram abhyupetya dīpāyate, viṣṇutayā vibhāti (Bs. 5.46). Viṣṇu has many forms. Some of the forms are personal forms, and some of the forms are separated forms.

So far the living entities are concerned, they are separated forms of Viṣṇu, vibhinnāṁśa. In the Varāha Purāṇa you will find that eko bahu-syām: Visnu, Lord Viṣṇu, has become many. Out of those many, those who are personal expansions, they are viṣṇu-tattva. And those who are separated expansion, they are jīva-tattva.

So jīvas, the living entities, they are part and parcel of Viṣṇu. Kṛṣṇa says . . . Kṛṣṇa and Viṣṇu are the same. Kṛṣṇa is the original Viṣṇu.

rāmādi-mūrtiṣu kalā-niyamena tiṣṭhan
nānāvatāram akarod bhuvaneṣu kintu
kṛṣṇaḥ svayaṁ samabhavat paramaḥ pumān yo
(Bs. 5.39)

Kṛṣṇa is the original Viṣṇu. So we have to satisfy Viṣṇu. That is the mission of life. The human form of life is a chance by going round the 8,400,000 species of life. This human form of life, by evolution we get the developed consciousness for understanding Viṣṇu. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ (SB 7.5.31). Unfortunately, there is no educational system, and they do not know, people do not know that their real interest of life is to approach Viṣṇu. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ. They do not know.

Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ (SB 7.5.31). Persons, they are trying to be happy by this material civilization, bahir-artha. Those who are trying to get some profit out of material activities, they are called bahir-artha-māninaḥ. They do not know that self-interest is Viṣṇu. They think, "My self-interest is to have some money" or a nice building or nice family, friends, like that. But this is called mohaḥ, illusion. Janasya moho 'yam ahaṁ mameti (SB 5.5.8). So:

na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ
durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ
(SB 7.5.31)

They are enamored by the external energy. This material world is manifestation of the external energy of Kṛṣṇa, Viṣṇu. Whatever we are seeing in this material world and whatever we are hearing about spiritual world, they are all manifestation of different energies of Viṣṇu. Parasya brāhmaṇa śaktis (Viṣṇu Purāṇa 1.22.53). Just like the sun is manifested by light and heat, or the fire is manifested by light and heat, similarly Lord Viṣṇu is manifested by His different energies, of which three are principal: external energy and spiritual energy and marginal energy.

This material manifestation is the action of the external energy, and spiritual world is manifestation of internal energy, and we, the living entities, we are manifestation of marginal energy—marginal because we are between the spiritual world and material world. If we like, we can live in the spiritual world, and if we like we can remain in the material world. We have got a little independence to make our choice.

So those who have chosen to live in this material world, they are called conditioned soul. Conditioned soul means they are living under many conditions of this material nature, and all these conditions are not very happy, they are all miserable, actually miserable condition. In Sanskrit it is called tritāpa yantranā, threefold miseries.

So the living entities, because they are part and parcel of Viṣṇu, so originally they are spiritual sparks, but somehow or other they have fallen down in this material world, just like a spark from the fire falls down on the ground and the brilliant, I mean to say, appearance of the spark becomes extinguished. As soon as a spark falls down from the fire it becomes extinguished, and if it falls on water it becomes too much extinguished, very moistened; very little chance of blazing. But if it falls down on dry grass, then that spark immediately creates some fire. And if the spark falls down simply on ground, it is via media between falling down on the water and dry grass.

So the spirit soul, when he comes down to this material world from Viṣṇu fire, then it contacts three kinds of material modes of nature: sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. Those who are in sattva-guṇa, they have got the brahminical qualification: satya śama damaḥ sucih titikṣa ārjava, jñānaṁ vijñānam āstikyaṁ brahma-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.42). And those who are in contact with the modes of passion, they are called kṣatriyas. And those who are mixed up with passion and ignorance, they are called vaiśyas. And those who are in completely darkness, they are called śūdras. And less than śūdra, they are called pañcamās or caṇḍālas.

Therefore human civilization should be conducted how to bring people on the standard of modes of goodness, or on the brahminical platform. That should be the aim of human civilization. Because as soon as one comes to the brahminical platform, then everything becomes manifest, prakāśa. Just like in sunshine you can see the whole city of London very nicely. In darkness you cannot see the same London city. Similarly, the whole cosmic manifestation and Lord Viṣṇu we cannot see unless we come to the platform of goodness, sattva-guṇa.

So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is going on to bring a certain percentage of the human society to the platform of modes of goodness. In another place it is stated that the brahmins, or those who are in the modes of goodness . . . when we speak of brahmin, it does not mean that a person born in brahmin family. We don't mean that. Brahmin means by qualifications.

cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ
guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ
(BG 4.13)

Lord Kṛṣṇa says that: "The four divisions of social order is made by Me." How? Guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ: by division of quality and work. Not that because one is born in a brahmin family, as it is going on in India. No. In the śāstra there is no such thing, janma-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. No. Guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ.

In the Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa personally says, guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. One must have the brahminical qualifications: truthful, clean, sattva, śauca. Sama—controlling the mind; damaḥ—controlling the senses; sattva śauca sama damah, titikṣā—tolerance; ārjava—simplicity; jñānaṁ—full knowledge; vijñānaṁ—practical application in life; jñānaṁ, āstikyaṁ—and full faith in Vedas, that is called āstikyaṁ. This is brahma-karma svabhāva-jam.

So the highest perfection of human life is to attain the brahminical qualification, then everything will be clearly understood: what is God, what I am, what is my relationship with God, what is this world. So many questions. But they are not interested. At the present moment people are not interested in these things, na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ. They are interested in animal propensities: how to eat nicely, how to sleep nicely, how to defend nicely, āhāra, nidrā, bhaya, and how to have sex life nicely. That's all.

But this is not the occupation of the human life; this is animal life. Simply to be busy with these four principles of life, āhāra, nidrā, bhaya, maithuna, that is animal propensities. A man has to go beyond that. Of course, so long we have got this body, the animal propensities will remain there, because the human being is defined in logic, a man is rationalist. I think this is not the proper definition. Rationality there is in animals also. The śāstric definition, dharma, dharmeṇa hīnāḥ paśubhiḥ samānāḥ (Hitopadeśa). Therefore in every human society there is a certain type of religion, faith, and the purpose of religion is to understand Viṣṇu, Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Lord.

So actually, at the present moment . . . not only the present moment; this is the nature. People forget their relationship with Viṣṇu, or Kṛṣṇa, and they therefore drag on this material existence. Dragging on material existence means repeatedly take birth and death, and in different species of life. Not that after death there is any guarantee that we shall get human form of life. There is no guarantee. Any form. There are 8,400,000 species of life forms. We can get any form according to our work.

Now suppose this is the truth, and if this life I waste and next life I become a tree, standing up for seven thousand years, ten thousand years in one place. Is that very good proposal?

Guest: No. Ignorance.

Prabhupāda: But people have taken this . . . to this life. They do not know how by nature's way we are changing our body according to our karma, and there are so many different types of bodies, we can get any one of them. We can become god, we can become dog, according to our karma.

yānti deva-vratā devān
pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ
bhūtāni yānti bhūtejyā
mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām
(BG 9.25)

These are the statement in the Bhagavad-gītā, that you can prepare your next life, you can promote yourself to the platform of the demigods like sun, moon, Brahmā and others, Indra, Candra. There are many. Their duration of life . . . you cannot calculate even their one day's duration. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā:

sahasra-yuga-paryantam
ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ
(BG 8.17)

These things are there. So you can elevate yourself to the platform of becoming demigods.

yānti deva-vratā devān
pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ
(BG 9.25)

You can elevate yourself to the Pitṛlokas or you can remain here in this planet. There are similar other planets also. Bhūloka, this is called Bhūloka, and above this there is Bhuvarloka, and above that there is Svargaloka, and above that there is Janaloka, and above that there is Satyaloka, and above that there is Brahmaloka. Seven upwards, seven downwards.

So these informations are there in the śāstras, in the Vedas. Unfortunately, we are not interested in the śāstric injunctions. We are simply interested how to eat nicely, how to sleep nicely, how to defend nicely and how to have sex life nicely. That's all. This is going on. But this is very dangerous civilization, andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās (SB 7.5.31). The example is just like a blind man is leading several other blind men. So what will be the result? All of them will fall down in the ditch.

andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās
te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ
(SB 7.5.31)

So many leaders are coming, they are misguiding people and they are going away in due course of time, being completely under the stringent laws of material nature. 'Pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. 'Pīśa-tantryām, by the rope made by īśa, or the Supreme Lord; uru-dāmni, very tightly knot.

So these things we do not know, although these informations are there in the śāstras, in the Vedic literatures. But we are not interested. So it is not very good civilization. It is misleading civilization. Therefore there is need of this movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is need in order to give right enlightenment to the people, because they do not know.

Na te viduḥ. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā. They are hoping something wonderful, which is impossible. What is that wonderful hope? They are trying to be happy within this material world. That's all. They do not know anything more. After death what is there, they do not care to know it. This is not very good civilization.

Therefore our . . . we have taken this task under superior order, to enlighten people in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The method is also very simple. Unfortunately that people are not at all interested; they are so much under the clutches of the external energy, durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ. So the progress is very slow, but our duty is to go door-to-door and inform them that "You be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Try to understand the value of your life."

That is our duty under the order of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Yāre dekha, tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa'-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). Lord Caitanya says that "You become a spiritual master under My order." And what is the business? "Whomever you meet, you just try to inform him about Kṛṣṇa." 'Kṛṣṇa'-upadeśa. It is not very difficult.

So to become spiritual master—not bogus, but genuine—is also not very difficult, because Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, "Under My order." The order is there, and the business is also there. What is the business? Simply speak about Kṛṣṇa, simply inform about Kṛṣṇa, whomever you meet. So we can speak about Kṛṣṇa because there is Bhagavad-gītā. Kṛṣṇa is speaking about Himself.

ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo
mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate
iti matvā bhajante māṁ
budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ
(BG 10.8)

"I am the origin of everything." Vedānta says that Absolute Truth is the origin of everything. Janmādy asya yataḥ, that is Absolute Truth, wherefrom everything is coming down. There must be something origin. You are born of your father, your father is born of his father, his father, his father, go on. So when you find the original father, then He is God. So there must be some original father. Otherwise, as there is no possibility of your appearance without father, similarly there is no possibility of the appearance of your father, his father. Then there must be. In the Vedānta-sūtra it clearly says, janmādy asya yataḥ: the first person from whom everything is emanating.

So how can you deny God? Is that very reasonable proposal? You may not know God, but there is God. That you have to accept—the original person. So if you go on researching who is that person . . . you can do that. That is called ascending process, āroha-panthā. Āroha-panthā. By . . . just like modern science, they want to search out the Absolute Truth, the empiric philosophers, but there is another method: inductive. This is called inductive.

And there is another method, deductive, avaroha-panthā, the message coming from higher level. Just like you understand in our childhood from father, parents, from teachers. So this is one knowledge, one process of knowledge. Another process: you search out. But so far God is concerned or anything is concerned, inductive process, āroha-panthā, is not perfect. The best process is to know from the authorities.

So you can know about Kṛṣṇa from Kṛṣṇa Himself, the best authority. Why should you make research what is called Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā about Himself, so take it. Then you can understand Kṛṣṇa, and then your human life, your interest for human life, will be fulfilled. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Simply try to understand Kṛṣṇa, then your life will be fulfilled; otherwise it will be failure.

Thank you very much. (devotees offer obeisances)

Indian man: (indistinct) . . . How shall we protect ourselves, and what are the benefits to one who can control the anger of mind and senses?

Prabhupāda: In the śāstra it is recommended that sahiṣṇutā—tolerance; and karuṇā—mercifulness; and maitra—friendship; and samatā—equality. There are different kinds of men in the society. Some of them are envious. Just like we are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness, some of them are envious. For such persons we shall be tolerant. Then karuṇā—mercifulness. Those who are actually innocent, do not know very much about Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we shall try to convince him about Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

That is mercifulness. And those who are already in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we shall keep friendship with them, maitra. And to the general public, all living entities, we shall treat them equally, because a devotee should know, or knows, that every living entity is the part and parcel of God, but he is, by his karma, in a different form of body. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18).

Therefore those who are in knowledge of the condition of the living entities in this material world, they do not help them; try to elevate them . . . The four principles we shall follow: tolerance, mercifulness, friendship and equal treatment. Then he will make advance, and Viṣṇu will be satisfied. If you practice these four principles, immediately you satisfy the Supreme Personality of Godhead and you become liberated. Simply you have to practice this, that's all.

Indian man (2): What is the true principle of human life to make success in this life?

Prabhupāda: To become Kṛṣṇa conscious. That I explained in the beginning. They do not know the real self-interest, na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ. These people, ordinarily they do not know that their target is Viṣṇu. They have taken something else as target of life. That is called durāśraya.

So success of life means to understand Viṣṇu, or Kṛṣṇa. That is success. Anything else, all failure. Therefore we are preaching to make them successful in their human form of life. All other, simply śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8), simply waste of time and labor. Without understanding Kṛṣṇa, anything. Eh?

dharmaḥ svanuṣṭhitaḥ puṁsāṁ
viṣvaksena-kathāsu yaḥ
notpādayed ratiṁ yadi
śrama eva hi kevalam
(SB 1.2.8)

You can execute a particular type of dharma, but if you do not develop your Kṛṣṇa consciousness by executing such dharma, then śrama eva hi kevalam, simply waste of time. Life is wasted, finished. Therefore we are giving the best contribution and the most efficient welfare activities, the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Try to understand this.

Indian man (3): Could you explain karma philosophy?

Prabhupāda: Karma philosophy: if you touch fire, your hand will be burned. If you eat poison, you'll die. What is the difficulty to understand? That is karma.

Indian man (3): No, talking about Kṛṣṇa and karma.

Prabhupāda: Yes, karma is as you work, so you get the result, that is karma. Karma, vikarma, akarma. These are explained in Bhagavad-gītā. Karma means . . . therefore śāstra gives you guidance that you act in this way.

yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
vartate kāma-kārataḥ
(BG 16.23)

If you don't take the direction of the śāstras, and if you go on working according to your whims, na sa siddhim avāpnoti, you will never get success, na sukhaṁ, neither happiness.

na siddhim sa avāpnoti
na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
(BG 16.23)

And what to speak of going back to Godhead?

Karma means just like a good citizen means he is acting according to the law of the state, and a bad citizen, criminal, who is violating the laws. Similarly, karma means, real karma means that—I began my lecture—varṇāśramācāra-vatā puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān. For regulating the karma these four divisions are: if you are Brahmin your karma is like this; you are kṣatriya, your karma is like this; you are vaiśya, your karma is like this; you are śūdra, your karma is like this; you are brahmacārī, your karma is like this. So this is very scientifically divided. You can put yourself in any division, and if you execute it perfectly, sa karmaṇā manasā vācā. And if you by your karma you worship Viṣṇu, then you're successful. In another place it is stated that:

ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā
varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ
(SB 1.2.13)

The karma is divided according to varṇā: brahmin, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, or brahmacārī, gṛhastha , vānaprastha. So varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ.

ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā
varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ
svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya
(SB 1.2.13)

Everyone, either brahmacārī or gṛhastha or brahmin or śūdra, svanuṣṭhitasya, following the regulative principles in each and every status of life, svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya saṁsiddhir, perfection. How? Hari-toṣaṇam. Whether by your karma you have satisfied Kṛṣṇa, never mind you are a śūdra or a vaiśya or a brahmin or a brahmacārī, it doesn't matter; everyone can do. Everyone, by his karma, can satisfy the Supreme.

So the test is you may be engaged in any karma, it doesn't matter, but the success of that karma is tested whether by such karma Kṛṣṇa, saṁsiddhir hari-toṣaṇam, you have satisfied Hari, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That's all. Just like in an office you may be engaged in any type of work, but by your work if you satisfy the head boss, then you are successful. It doesn't matter whether you are a peon or a clerk or a salesman. It doesn't matter. The only point is whether by your karma you have satisfied the boss. That is success.

So you can be engaged in any karma. It doesn't matter. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna was a military man. So he satisfied Kṛṣṇa by his military work; therefore he is successful. So that is the test. There are so many divisions of karmas or dharmas. Karma and dharma, the same thing. Dharma means prescribed duty, and duty means working. That is karma. So you can be situated in any position of different grades of karma, but if you are able to satisfy by your karma the Supreme, then you are successful. Otherwise you are bound up.

yajñārthāt karmaṇo 'nyatra
karma-bandhanaḥ
(BG 3.9)

You will be entangled. You will never be liberated if you are entangled; simply enjoy. If you do not try to work to satisfy Yajñā, or Viṣṇu, then it will be karma-bandhanaḥ.

Indian man: (Hindi: Swamiji for how many days are you staying in London? Can't we get your darshan in the second week?)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi: For as many days you say. Second week . . .)

(break) (Prabhupāda leads kīrtana) (prema-dhvani) Thank you very much.

Devotees: All glories to you Śrīla Prabhupāda. (devotees offer obeisances) (end)