720224 - Lecture - Calcutta
Prabhupāda: . . . identified with this material body. This is material life. Actually, I am spirit soul. I am not matter. Everyone can understand it, because the theory that living condition is developed under certain material condition. Just like we see sometimes that one germ is coming out the stool.
So people who are less intelligent, they say that the matter is producing a living being. There is another instance, vṛścika-taṇḍula-nyāya (nyāya-śāstra). Sometimes we see the scorpion is coming out from a heap of rice. So we are thinking that the rice is giving, generating, a life, and that is not fact. The fact is that the scorpions, they lay down eggs within the rice, and by the fermentation of the rice it . . . a small scorpion come out.
So matter is not the cause of generating life. That's not a fact. Actually the living entity develops his body. Just like when there is sex intercourse, man and woman, the secretion mixes together; it becomes emulsified within the womb, and if the circumstances is favorable, then a living entity takes shelter of the secretion and the body develops. This is science. Not that the secretion itself in . . . generating the body, generating the life. No.
- karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa
- jantur dehopapattaye
- (SB 3.31.1)
According to our karma, we are observed about our karmas, or activities, by superior intelligence. So we act sinfully or piously, and according to that, our action, the resultant body is offered by the material nature.
- prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni
- guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ
- kartāham iti manyate
- (BG 3.27)
We are under the grip of the laws of material nature, and according to our karma we are getting different types of body and transmigrating from one body to another. And then once we take birth, we live for some time, we grow the body, then we produce some by-products, then it, the body, dwindles, and at last it vanishes. It vanishes means you accept another body. Again the body is growing, the body is staying, body is producing by-product, again dwindling and again vanishing. This is going on. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19).
So this is our problem. But our brain is so dull that we do not touch the real problem. We are very much busy with the temporary problem. Just like when there is disease, it is a problem. But we do not try to understand that as soon as I get a body, disease must be there. I have already accepted all these problems, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi, as soon as I have agreed to accept a material body. That is my real problem. If somebody says that, "You are going there, there is some danger there," so when you meet that danger, why you say that it is problem? It was already informed. So Kṛṣṇa informs you that this is real problem:
- (BG 13.9)
Why you are so busy for the temporary problem? This is your real problem. So if you want to solve the real problem of life, then you have to withdraw your attachment from this material world and replace that attachment to Kṛṣṇa. This is the solution of problem. So long you will be materially attached, so long you have to accept this material body and different condition. Attachment for this body means attachment for the senses. The body means senses, indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur. Our this material body means we have got some senses; we want to satisfy them. That is material life.
- indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur
- indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ
- (BG 3.42)
And those who are not successful—nobody is successful in satisfying the senses—then he tries to satisfy the mind. Gross enjoyment. The karmīs, they are trying to enjoy this world by the senses. They are called karmīs. When, when he is baffled in sense enjoyment, then he manufactures something from the mind, and he thinks this is enjoyment—some poetry, some rascal philosophy.
(aside) Come on, come on.
Mental speculation. They think this is . . .
- indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur
- indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ
- (BG 3.42)
The mental speculation. Then when mental speculation fails, then intellectual speculation. So intellectual speculation, if one comes to that stage, then by intellect . . . intellect means to use one's intelligence whether I am this body or I am this mind. How I can use my intelligence? When I come to Bhagavad-gītā, I see that neither this body, neither this mind I am. I am identifying with this body or I, I am identifying with this mind. That I am not. I have nothing to do with this. That is called brahma-jñāna. And Kṛṣṇa says that:
- bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ
- khaṁ mano buddhir (eva ca)
- ahaṅkāra itīyaṁ me
- prakṛtir bhinnā aṣṭadhā
- (BG 7.4)
So this material world means combination of these eight kinds of material energy: earth, water, air, fire, ether, mind, intelligence and ego, and the living entity. The living entity is superior quality energy. Kṛṣṇa says, apareyam itas viddhi me prakṛtiṁ parā jīva-bhūtā (BG 7.5). Jīva-bhūtā. And that, that is another energy of Kṛṣṇa. This is inferior energy, material energy. Mind, intelligence, ego, that is also material. Subtle, very fine, but that is also material energy.
So these eight kinds of material energies plus the superior energy, the living entity, combination, that is this material world. Kṛṣṇa will say, etad yonīni sarvāṇi. Whatever forms of life you are seeing:
- etad-yonīni bhūtāni
- sarvāṇīty upadhāraya
- ahaṁ kṛtsnasya jagataḥ
- prabhavaḥ pralayas tathā
- (BG 7.6)
So whatever forms of life you are observing, yoni . . . yoni means species of life. They have different varieties of form, but that does not mean simply human species. No. There are 8,400,000 species. There are aquatics, insects, birds, beasts, trees, so many things. All of them, Kṛṣṇa will say that another place, ahaṁ sarvasya . . . bīja . . . ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pita (BG 14.4). All of them.
Because this exhibition of different varieties of forms and life, they are made of Kṛṣṇa's two energies: material energy and the spiritual energy. Therefore all of them belongs to Kṛṣṇa, because it is Kṛṣṇa's energy. So we cannot say that we are free from Kṛṣṇa. When you understand that "Whatever I have got, it is emanation from Kṛṣṇa," janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1), Vedānta-sūtra says . . . "Everything is emanated from the Supreme. He is Absolute Truth, Brahman."
So from the Absolute Truth, Brahman, Para-brahman, Kṛṣṇa, these two energies are emanating, and combination of these two energies, that is material world. Similarly, there is another world, paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo (BG 8.20), spiritual world, where there is no more this material energy; there is only spiritual energy. That spiritual energy, that the body is also the same and the . . . there is no question of the soul is different from the body. Here the body is material and the soul is spiritual. Combination. And the spiritual world, there is no such difference between body and the soul. The same ingredient, body and soul.
So if it is possible for the ordinary living entity to become of the same quality, body and soul, how Kṛṣṇa can be different from the body and soul? But so-called scholars, they think that Kṛṣṇa is as different from the soul as we are. Now, therefore Kṛṣṇa says:
- avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā
- mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam
- (BG 9.11)
Kṛṣṇa, when He comes, He comes with His spiritual body. Just like when a . . . when the governor goes the, goes to the jail, it does not mean that he is one of the members of the jail. No. Similarly, when Kṛṣṇa comes within this material world, He does not become a member of this material world. Etad īśanam īśasya (SB 1.11.38). That is called īśanam, all-powerfulness, that in spite of His coming in this material world, He is not one of the material living entities as we are.
If you think like that, that Kṛṣṇa is like one of us, then we are mūḍhā, avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā, and mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam: "Because I come in the human form, therefore those who are mūḍhās, rascals, they think that I am also human being." He is not human being. He is God, Supreme Lord.
Therefore Kṛṣṇa says that janma karma me divyam jan . . . yo jānāti tattvataḥ (BG 4.9). Kṛṣṇa also appears, just like Kṛṣṇa appears as the son of Devakī; a father, Vasudeva. But actually, as described in the śāstras, He did not come out from the womb of His mother. He first appeared before them in catur-bhuja, nārāyaṇa mūrti.
And when Devakī prayed that . . . she, she was always anxious that Kaṁsa would kill. She knew that, "God is coming within my womb," but she was, because she was woman, she was also afraid that, "Kaṁsa will kill my son." Mother's affection. She could not believe that God cannot be killed, but because God became her son, out of affection she was thinking that, "My dear son, You kindly wind up Your four hands; You become two-handed child. Otherwise Kaṁsa will immediately kill."
So this is divyam, janma. Janma karma me divyam. Kṛṣṇa's birth is not ordinary birth. Kṛṣṇa's birth is different from ordinary birth. The ordinary child does not come before his father and mother in four hands and if a mother requests that, "You become two-handed and become ordinary child." No. She (he) has to take place within the womb of his mother. Therefore the . . . Kṛṣṇa's birth and ordinary child's birth is not the same.
That is divyam. Janma karma me divyam. And karma . . . when He was three years old . . . three months old, lying down on the lap of His mother, Pūtanā came to kill Him, but Kṛṣṇa sucked her breast and killed her. And seven years old, He lifted the Govardhana Hill, Govardhanadhārī. Therefore His karma, His activities, are also divyam. His janma is divyam; His karma is divyam. Yo jānāti tattvataḥ.
Somebody will say these are stories because they, they are unbeliever. If Kṛṣṇa is God, then is it very difficult thing for Him to kill a Pūtanā or to lift a Govardhana Hill? Kṛṣṇa is supporting millions of planets, bigger, bigger than this planet. You can . . . we can imagine, this planet is filled with so many great seas, mountains and heavy buildings and so many things, but it is floating like a straw, like an atom in the air. Similarly, not only one; there are millions and millions of planets floating in the air in one universe, and there are millions and millions of universes, and Kṛṣṇa says:
- atha vā bahunaitena
- kiṁ jñātena tavārjuna
- viṣṭabhyāham idaṁ kṛtsnam
- ekāṁśena sthito jagat
- (BG 10.42)
"All this material world, cosmic manifestation, sthitaḥ, is existing on the strength of My one part energy."
So if Kṛṣṇa can sustain so many planets by His energy, is it very difficult for Him to lift a mountain when He was seven years old? This is called yo jānāti tattvataḥ. One must know Kṛṣṇa. Not that we take simply advantage of Kṛṣṇa's rāsa-līlā, as the professional reciters do. No. We should know Kṛṣṇa perfectly.
We cannot know Kṛṣṇa perfectly well, but as far as they are described in the śāstras. Kṛṣṇa is describing Himself here, that bhūmir āpo analo vāyuḥ (BG 7.4), "They are My energy." Why don’t you take it? How you can explain this bhūmi? Wherefrom this earth has come out? Wherefrom the water has come out? Wherefrom the air has come out? Ha? You will say that, "Chemical combination."
The other day I was asking in Madras, one gentleman was chemist, so I said that, "Your theory, that this water is produced by combination of hydrogen and oxygen—now, who supplied the tons of hydrogen and oxygen to make the sea? This is reasonable question. Who supplied?
I accept there is hydrogen and oxygen mixture, but who is the chemist who prepared or who is the chemical supplier? Who supplied?" Then you have to go to Kṛṣṇa. Janmādy asya yataḥ: everything is from Kṛṣṇa. And Kṛṣṇa says also, "I supplied. I created,"
- bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ
- khaṁ mano buddhir eva ca
- (BG 7.4)
So what is the difficulty? Kṛṣṇa is explaining Himself in the Bhagavad-gītā. You try to understand. And He says: "If you understand Me in truth, then you are liberated." Why don't you do this? What is the difficulty? He says plainly, janma karma me divyam yo jānāti tattvataḥ (BG 4.9). In truth. Everything explained in the śāstras. So you try to understand.
That is Kṛṣṇa understanding. And if you understand, if you accept, we may be fools, but we accept what Kṛṣṇa says; therefore we have no difficulty. We do not make any research what is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, "I am this," we believe Him. That's all.
Therefore we are presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is. We have no difficult to underst . . . difficulty to understand Kṛṣṇa. Our only qualification is that what Kṛṣṇa says, we agree to. Just like Arjuna did. Arjuna said, after hearing from Bhagavad-gītā:
- sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye
- yan māṁ vadasi keśava
- (BG 10.14)
"My dear Keśava, Kṛṣṇa, whatever You have said, I believe it in total." That is Bhagavad-gītā, our understanding. Why shall I interpret nonsensically, this way, that way? There is no question of nonsensically interpreting Bhagavad-gītā. You try to understand Bhagavad-gītā as Arjuna understands, who directly heard from Kṛṣṇa. There is no difficulty. We do that. We do that, and we believe it firmly. Nobody can change our position. Not that we are blindly. If you argue, we can convince you. Not only one—everyone.
So if you say that, "You blindly believe in Kṛṣṇa's word. If I argue with you, how you will be able to defend?" Yes, I shall be able to defend. How? That Kṛṣṇa says:
- buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi taṁ
- yena mām upayānti te
- (BG 10.10)
Kṛṣṇa will supply you with intelligence. However nonsense . . . nonsensically you argue with me, I shall be able to defeat you, because Kṛṣṇa is within me, and He promises, buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi taṁ. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is nothing difficult to become a Kṛṣṇa conscious person. Simply you have to believe, understand, not blindly. Suppose Kṛṣṇa says that, "This bhūmi, this earth, is created by My energy." If you deny, "No, no. It is not His energy," then prove whose energy has created.
What is your statement? Wherefrom this earth has come? You have not created. But that kind of explanation . . . just like so-called philosophers and scientists say that there was a chunk, and it becomes burst out, and there becomes planets. And wherefrom this chunk came? You see? These nonsense things are going on. They are scientists. Wherefrom this chunk came? There was a chunk. Their . . . their origin of creation is a chunk. They don’t believe that it, it was created by Kṛṣṇa. A chunk created this such whole cosmic manifestation, and it is working so nicely and regularly and producing so many things—the origin is a chunk. You see?
So we are not so foolish we have to believe this rascal philosophy and scientific statement, "There was a chunk and there was creation." No. Here from the śāstras we understand that there is the original source of everything, janmādy asya yataḥ. Then what kind of that original source? That is explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: janmādy asya yato 'nvayād itarataś cārtheṣv abhijñaḥ (SB 1.1.1). That janmādy asya yataḥ, that source, is a living entity with sense, not impersonal non-sense. Abhijñaḥ. This word is used. The Vedānta-sūtra is explained by the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Bhāṣyaṁ brahma-sūtrānām (Garuḍa Purāṇa). The Vedānta-sūtra is known as Brahma-sūtra.
So this is the natural commentary, or explanation, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Because in the Vedānta-sūtra it is said that the original source, there is original source, Brahman, athātho brahma-jijñāsā. What is that Brahman? "Now inquire about Brahman." Now, whom it is spoken? To the human society. That in so many lives, lives after lives in the evolutionary process, if you, you have simply tried for maintaining your body, āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca (Hitopadeśa 25), but this life, this human form of life, don’t waste like cats and dog. Try to understand the Brahman. What is that Brahman? Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). That Brahman is the supreme cause of everything. (end)