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750411 - Lecture SB 05.05.02 - Hyderabad

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His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

750411SB-HYDERABAD - April 11, 1975 - 66:12 Minutes


mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes
tamo-dvāraṁ yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam
mahāntas te sama-cittāḥ praśāntā
vimanyavaḥ suhṛdaḥ sādhavo ye
(SB 5.5.2)

Last night we had discussion on the first verse, Fifth Chapter, Fifth Canto, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, that this human life is meant for tapasya. Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyet sattvam (SB 5.5.1). We have to purify our existence. This is the mission of human life. At the present moment we are transmigrating from one body to another, and there are 8,400,000 species of life we are going through according to karma. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha upapattaye (SB 3.31.1). How we develop a certain type of body, that is stated—everything is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam—by our karma. I have explained last night, it is just like infection. We are associating with different types of the modes of material nature. Generally there are three types of material nature, three qualities: sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. Now, you multiply these three by three: it becomes nine. And again you multiply nine by nine: it becomes eighty-one. It is mixture. Here these guṇas, the qualities, are not pure. They are mixed up. Just like color mixing. Originally there are three colors: red, yellow and blue. And you mix it. . . Those who are color expert, they can display many thousands of colors. So similarly, in the nature's way there are different colors or different guṇas, and every one of us, we have got a particular type of guṇa with different desires, different plans, different so many things.

Now, in the human form of life, you have got the chance to discriminate yourself or separate yourself from these colorful different species of life. That is the main duty of human form of life. Labdhvā sudurlabham idaṁ bahu-sambhavānte (SB 11.9.29). We do not know; we have forgotten that how many species of life we have come through, transmigrating from one after another. Therefore this human form of life is called labdhvā sudurlabham idaṁ bahu-sambhavānte. After many, many births. We should not misuse it. Very responsible life. If you are misled, that is a dangerous civilization. That is going on. Dehātma-buddhi. As our chief guest Mr. Naidu said, that deha means śarīra, mind, and then spirit. Yes. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is explained,

indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur
indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ
manasas tu parā buddhir
buddhes tu paratas saḥ
(BG 3.42)

First of all, we are interested with these senses. This body means the senses, different types of senses. Sense objects, the mind. They have twenty-four elements analyzed by the Sāṅkhya philosophy. So when we think of our body, means we are interested with sense gratification. Then, a little forward, we are interested with the mind. First of all body, this gross body made of five: earth, air, fire, water, and ether. Then we become interested with the mental speculation, psychology—thinking, feeling, willing. So indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ (BG 3.42). Mind. The mental speculators, the jñānī, they are better than the karmīs. Karmīs means who are simply entrapped with this sensual gratification, that's all. So jñānī, karmī, jñānī, and yogī, and then, when one is interested with the spirit soul and spirit soul's activities, then he is bhakta. That is. . . Actually the basic principle of activity is the soul. As soon as the soul is gone, there is no more activity, either mental activity or bodily activity. So if we want actually progress of life, then we must realize our constitutional position as the spirit soul, not as the mind, not as the body. Therefore śāstra says,

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke
sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ
yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij
janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-kharaḥ
(SB 10.84.13)

Go-khara. Go means cow, and khara means ass. If one is under the bodily concept of life, ātma-buddhi, yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātu. . . This body is made of three dhātus: kapha, pitta, vāyu. If we take this body, this bag made of bones and flesh and blood and urine and stool and so many other things, muscles. . . Kuṇape tri-dhātuke.. This is a material bag. And if one takes this bag as he himself, then, according to that conception of life, yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu. . . (SB 10.84.13). Kalatra means wife, and through wife there are children, society, friendship and love and so many things. Sva-dhīḥ. And that is our own thing. Yasyātma-buddhiḥ. The nationalism is also like that. Sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ: and the land of birth as worshipable, bhauma ijya-dhīḥ. This bhauma ijya-dhīḥ is nationalism. Of course, there is no such thing in the Vedic literature as nationalism. This is modern product. But this word is there, bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ, the land of birth. . . That is also explained in some other Vedic literature, jananī janma-bhūmiś ca svargād api garīyasi. People like it, but this is. . . All are on the bodily concept of life.

So one has to go above. Indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ. . . (BG 3.42). Lord Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā, indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ manasas tu parā buddhiḥ. That intelligence required. Just like Sanātana Gosvāmī, one of the chief disciples of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He was the chief minister in the government of Nawab Hussain Shah, and he was born in a very high class brāhmaṇa family, sārasvata family, and he was very learned scholar in Sanskrit and Urdu and Arabic, very learned scholar. So when he submitted himself after resigning his post as minister, submitted to Lord Caitanya, he put this question, that grāmya-vyavahāre paṇḍita, tāi satya māni (CC Madhya 20.100). A brāhmaṇa. . . Still in our India, a brāhmaṇa is addressed as paṇḍita. Brāhmaṇa means paṇḍita. Brāhmaṇa-paṇḍita, brāhmaṇa-vaiṣṇava, that a. . . Learned scholar. So in the society he was addressed as "Paṇḍitjī." So he protested against it. He said to Caitanya Mahāprabhu, grāmya-vyavahāre: "In ordinary behavior they call me paṇḍita." Grāmya-vyavahāre paṇḍita, tāi satya māni: "And I am such a fool that I accept myself also as a paṇḍita." It is his humbleness. He was paṇḍita, certainly. But he says, "Why I am not paṇḍita?" Because āpanāra hitāhita kichui nā jāni: "I am such a learned scholar that I do not know what is actually good for me. This is my learning. And I have become a leader. I do not know what is the aim of my life, what is my identification. People address me as paṇḍita, and I take it as fact. But actually I am not a paṇḍita. I do not know what I am. I am thinking I am this body. I am thinking I am this mind." So that is our position.

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke
sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ
yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij
janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-kharaḥ
(SB 10.84.13)

We should know "What I am." That is Vedānta-sūtra. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is human life. Jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā. These dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, CC Ādi 1.90), the Bhāgavata has rejected. Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). Atra, dharmādi-kāma-mokṣa-projjhitaḥ. Prakṛṣṭa-rūpeṇa ujjhita—thrown away. Śrīla Śrīdhara Svāmī, the most authorized commentator of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, he said, atra mokṣa-vāñchā api nirastam(?). Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavaḥ atra, that is also kaitava. Kaitava means cheating. Above that, above mokṣa, that is spiritual platform. That is to be understood.

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
na śocati na kāṅkṣati
samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām
(BG 18.54)

After realizing Brahman identification, ahaṁ brahmāsmi, that is called brahma-bhūta. And the symptom of that brahma-bhūta stage is na śocati na kāṅkṣati. There is no more lamentation. So long we are in the bodily platform, there are two things prominent: lamentation and aspiration, hankering. Two things. We hanker after things which we do not possess, and what we possess, if we lose, then we cry. This is our position. So if actually he's Brahman realized, then he has no more hankering or lamentation. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati. Then samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. Then, from that platform, you can think of equality. Not on the material platform. It is not possible.

So long we are in this material platform, bodily concept of life, then there will be distinction: "I am Indian," "You are American," "You are Englishman," "You are this," ". . .that," so many things, so many designations. Therefore, if you want to rise up to the platform of spiritual realization, then the formula is sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). That is the beginning. That means beginning is the brahma-bhūta platform. Brahma-bhūta. . . Same thing. It is, Nārada Pañcarātra, sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam, and brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54), Bhagavad-gītā, the same thing. Wherever you find the Vedic literature, the same thing. Therefore it is authority. There is no contradiction. In the material platform you write one book, I write one book, then I disagree with you, and you disagree with me. That is material platform. But in the spiritual platform, there is self-realized platform. There is no mistake, there is no illusion, there is no imperfect senses and there is no cheating. That is spiritual platform. So the Bhagavad-gītā says, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati (BG 18.54). The same thing is confirmed in the Nārada Pañcarātra:

tat-paratvena nirmalam
hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-
sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate
(CC Madhya 19.170)

This is the platform we have to come, spiritual platform, wherein hṛṣīkeṇa. . . Hṛṣīka means the senses, the material senses and the spiritual senses. So what is the spiritual senses? Spiritual sense is not senselessness. No. Purified senses. In the impurified senses I am thinking, "This body is Indian; therefore I am meant for serving India," "This body is American; therefore I am meant for giving service to America." This is upādhi. But spiritual sense means the sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam—"I am no more Indian, no more American, no more brāhmaṇa, no more śūdra." Then what I am? As Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, as Kṛṣṇa also said, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam. . . (BG 18.66). That is spiritual platform, that "I am no more belonging to this dharma or that dharma. I am simply surrendered soul to Kṛṣṇa." This is sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). If one can come to this platform of spiritual understanding, that "I am spirit soul. Ahaṁ brahmāsmi. I am part and parcel of God. . ." Mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7). Kṛṣṇa says, "All these living entities, they are My part and parcel." Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7): "He is struggling for existence, being enwrapped by the mind and the body." This is the position.

So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is educating people that "You are not this body, not this mind, not this intelligence, but above this. You are spirit soul." So Kṛṣṇa confirms that mamaivāṁśa. So if Kṛṣṇa is spirit, supreme spirit, then you are also supreme spirit. But the only difference is that He is the supreme; we are subordinate. Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetanānām eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti. . . (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). This is Vedic injunction. He's also living entity, we are also living entity, but He is supreme and we are subordinate. That is the difference. Eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān. This is our position. This is self-realization. When you understand this, that "Kṛṣṇa, or the Supreme Lord, or God, whatever you say, He's the whole spirit soul, and we are fragmental portion of that spirit soul, and He's the maintainer; we are maintained. He is the predominator; we are predominated," so this is first realization, brahma-bhūta. This is called brahma-bhūta. And if you make more advance in brahma-bhūta stage, then maybe after many births you can understand what is Kṛṣṇa. That is the ver. . . Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19). Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate. When one is perfectly jñānavān, wise, then his business is vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). Then he can understand that Vāsudeva, the son of Vasudeva, Kṛṣṇa, is everything. That realization required. That is the perfection of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

So this movement is very scientific, authorized, Vedic, and people are accepting them. Therefore I repeatedly request our Indian brothers, "Don't neglect. Take this movement very seriously." That is the only business of human life. Jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā. That is. . .

vadanti tat tattva-vidas
tattvaṁ yaj jñānam advayam
brahmeti paramātmeti
bhagavān. . .
(SB 1.2.11)

Tattva-jijñāsā, that is the main business. Now, what is that tattva? That is explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavata, vadanti tat tattva-vidas tattvam: "Those who are aware of the tattva, they say that tattva means the Supreme Absolute Truth." Vadanti tat tattva-vidas tattvaṁ yaj jñānam advayam (SB 1.2.11). Jñānam, that knowledge, is advaya. Advaya means without any duality. But they are expressed in three different ways—Brahman, Paramātmā and Bhagavān—brahmeti paramātmeti. . . according to the stage of understanding. Those who are in the lower stage—we cannot say lower; in the beginning stage—that is Brahman realization. And one who has made further progress, that is Paramātmā realized. And one who has made further progress, that is Bhagavān realization. This is the verdict. So if you realize Bhagavān, then vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). Then you'll understand that Vāsudeva, Bhagavān, He is Paramātmā; He's also Brahman. Rather, He is Para-brahman.

That is confirmed by Arjuna after understanding Bhagavad-gītā: paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12). Para-brahman, Brahman realization; Paramātmā realization; and above Brahman and Paramātmā there is Para-brahman. That is Kṛṣṇa. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa. . . (BG 7.19). Who can understand? One, if he. . . If one understands this, that Kṛṣṇa is Para-brahman—vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti—He's also Paramātmā, He's also impersonal Brahman—sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ: "He becomes the great mahātmā." Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ (BG 9.13). That mahātmā is under the control of daivī-prakṛti, spiritual energy. He's no more under the material energy. As soon as he understands Kṛṣṇa—vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti—he's no more under material energy.

daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī
mama māyā duratyayā
mām eva ye prapadyante
māyām etāṁ taranti te
(BG 7.14)

This is the way. So this human form of life is very valuable, especially those who are born in India. Those who are born in India, it is automatically Kṛṣṇa conscious. Unfortunately, we are killing that consciousness. This is our advancement of civilization. So our only request is that "Don't kill yourself. Don't commit suicide. Take this Kṛṣṇa consciousness." It is explained very nicely in the Bhagavad-gītā. Kṛṣṇa is explaining Himself. Why should we not understand Kṛṣṇa? Why? Why we are spoiling our life? Of course, Bhagavad-gītā is very popular book. Practically everyone reads. But unfortunately they do not. . . most of them, they do not take Bhagavad-gītā as it is. That is the difficulty. If you take Bhagavad-gītā as it is, you become self-realized, liberated soul. But the misfortune is that we become more than Kṛṣṇa, and we want to comment Bhagavad-gītā in our own way. That is our misfortune. (applause) That is our misfortune.

So don't be misfortunate. Be fortunate. Everything is there. Try to understand Bhagavad-gītā. And here, in the Fifth Chapter, Fifth Canto, of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, the same thing is recommended by Ṛṣabhadeva to His sons. The first paragraph we have discussed last night. The second paragraph, the Ṛṣabhadeva says, mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ (SB 5.5.2). If you want to be liberated from this entanglement of bodily concept of life and mental concept of life and become more and more entangled in the process of transmigration of the soul from one body to another. . . That is entanglement. And to come out of this entanglement is called mukti. That is mukti: no more material body, no more material mind—everything is spiritual. That is called mukti. So Ṛṣabhadeva recommends that if you want mukti, if you want to come out of the entanglement of bodily concept of life and mental concept of life, then mahat-sevā: associate with mahātmās. Mahat. Mahat means who are not crippled, who are broad-minded. Mahat-sevā. You have to serve him. In the. . . One Vaiṣṇava ācārya, he says, chāḍiyā vaiṣṇava-sevā nistāra pāyeche kebā. If you do not agree to serve mahat. . . That is the Vedic injunction. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). This is the injunction. So mahat-sevā, the same thing. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram. Dvāram means the way, the gate, the gateway. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ (SB 5.5.2).

If you want to be free from this entanglement. . . It is very great shackle, repetition of birth and death, bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). One should understand this implication, how we are implicated. We are thinking, "Now I am very happy." No, next moment you can become a low-graded body, because karmaṇā daiva. . . If we are acting in a different way, the nature's way is to give you. . . Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu (BG 13.22). Guṇa-saṅga. As we are associating, infecting the different types of material modes of nature, the body is ready immediately. Everything is explained. Yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran bhāvaṁ tyajaty ante kalevaram (BG 8.6). At the time of death everything will be, I mean to say, the atmosphere of our death. So, sadā tad-bhāva-bhāvitaḥ. If you have acted like devas or bhaktas, then tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9): you can immediately transfer to the spiritual world, go to Kṛṣṇa, go to Vaikuṇṭha. Yānti deva. . . Yānti deva-vratā devān (BG 9.25). If you are thinking of some demigods whom you are worshiping, you can go there. Bhūtejyā yānti bhūtāni, pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ, mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām. If you think of Kṛṣṇa, then you go immediately. Yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama (BG 15.6). Everything is there.

So why should we waste our time? Why we should be entangled in this bodily concept of life and become subjected to the transmigration of the soul from one body to another? We should be disgusted, this repetition of birth and death. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). One should be intelligent enough to understand, "Why I should be subjected to birth and death?" Nobody wants to die. Ke āmi kene āmāya jāre tāpa-traya (CC Madhya 20.102). Nobody wants the threefold miserable condition of this material life, but it is forced upon us, and we are thinking "independent." That is foolishness. We are not independent. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). As you are associating with the different modes of material nature, the prakṛti, material nature, by pulling your ear, "You'll come on here. Take this body." "No, I don't want." "No, that is not your discretion. Now you have infected, you see. You must take this body." This risk is there. And just to forget ourself we sometimes say, "No, there is no life after death." Why there is no life after death? You were a child. The child became a boy, the boy became a young man, the young man became an old man, and what is the old man? He must have a body, next body. That is not simply mental speculation. This is confirmed by the most exalted authority, by Kṛṣṇa. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). As you have changed your body in so many ways from babyhood to childhood, childhood to boyhood, boyhood to youthhood, then, similarly, dehāntara-prāptiḥ.

Now, Kṛṣṇa does not say what kind of body you are going to get. That will depend on your work. Just like this is described as the dress. Now, if this dress is spoiled or torn, you have to purchase another dress. That will depend on your purchasing power. Similarly, after this dress is spoiled, no more usable, you have to purchase another body. That may be a dog's body or a god's body—that depends on your purchasing power. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā that yānti deva-vratā devān (BG 9.25). There are deva-lokas—Indraloka, Candraloka, Brahmaloka, so many—millions of years' age, a thousand times better standard of life. That also you can get. Yānti deva-vratā devān pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ. And if you are in the karma-kāṇḍīya, then you can go to the pitṛ-loka. And bhūtejyā yānti bhūtāni: and if you remain a materialistic person, you remain here. And mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām: and if you worship Kṛṣṇa, if you become a devotee of Kṛṣṇa, then you go to Kṛṣṇaloka. So why should we waste our time? Ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). Even if you go, be promoted to the Brahmaloka, still you have to wander within these so many planets, so many bodies. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu says,

ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa bhramite kona bhāgyavān jīva
guru-kṛṣṇa-kṛpāya pāya bhakti-latā-bīja
(CC Madhya 19.151)

In this way we are wandering, different 8,400,000 species of life in different planets. Out of many, many millions of living entities wandering in this way, if one is fortunate, he gets the seed of bhakti-yoga. Then his life is successful. So that bhakti-yoga—Kṛṣṇa consciousness means bhakti-yoga—by the grace of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu we are distributing. We are distributing not whimsically, but Caitanya Mahāprabhu wanted it.

bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra
janma sārthaka kari' kara para-upakāra
(CC Adi 9.41)

This is injunction. This is also injunction of Kṛṣṇa. What Kṛṣṇa said, Caitanya Mahāprabhu said the same thing. The difference is that Kṛṣṇa commanded as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but Caitanya Mahāprabhu—He's also Kṛṣṇa—He's teaching as a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. That is the difference. The same thing. Kṛṣṇa said that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66), and Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). He never said that "Whatever I am saying, you say." No, this is not paramparā system. A guru or a preacher or an ācārya does not manufacture anything concocted. He says the same thing. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). That is the difference between ācārya and a bogus man. A bogus man says something that "Now I say like this." No, who are you? No. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam, Kṛṣṇa says. We have to accept that.

So, therefore Ṛṣabhadeva says that mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ (SB 5.5.2). If you want to be free from this entanglement, then mahat-sevā. Who is mahat, mahat-sevā? That is also stated in the śāstra:

svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ
kapilo kumāraḥ manuḥ
prahlādo janako bhīṣmo
balir vaiyāsakir vayam
(SB 6.3.20)

There are twelve mahājanas: Svayambhū, Lord Brahmā; Nārada Muni; and Śambhu, Lord Śiva. Svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ (SB 6.3.20). Kapila, Kapiladeva, who gave us the Sāṅkhya philosophy, Devahūti-putra Kapiladeva, Devahūti-putra; and Kumāra, Catuḥsana Kumāra; Manu, Vaivasvata Manu. Manu. . . Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha (BG 4.1). This Manu is mahājana. So we have to follow. Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). You cannot manufacture. Then you are going to hell. Follow these big, big personalities. Then you'll get.

Therefore it is said, mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ (SB 5.5.2). Don't manufacture. That is not. . . Kṛṣṇa says mām ekam. You cannot say, "Then any path will be easy." No. Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). If you want to know Kṛṣṇa, then you have to accept bhakti, nothing else. Kṛṣṇa never says jñāna or yoga or karma will help you. No, that will not help. That will entangle you more and more—again repetition of birth and death. But if you take bhakti-yoga as Kṛṣṇa says, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti. . . He never says, Kṛṣṇa, that "By mental speculation or by fruitive activities or by gymnastic of the yoga system. . ." No. Yoginām api sarveṣām. Kṛṣṇa has explained yoga system in the Sixth Chapter of Bhagavad-gītā. And He concludes,

yoginām api sarveṣāṁ
śraddhāvān bhajate yo māṁ
sa me yuktatamo mataḥ
(BG 6.47)

"He's first-class yogī who is always thinking of Me within the heart."

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare
Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare

This is perfection.

Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda. (break)

Guest (1): Brahma-sūtra, as propounded by Vyāsa, is one. It is only one. But after reading Brahma-sūtra, the bhāṣyas—Śaṅkara-bhāṣya, Madhva-bhāṣya and Śrī-bhāṣya as written by Rāmānujācārya—all these things differ in many ways, and the reader is confused to know what is actually existing. Am I to follow this or that or this? Because "Jagat is mithyā," it is said by Śaṅkarācārya. Madhvācārya says, "It's not mithyā. It is realistic." It's contradiction. And Rāmānuja used another way of explanation, that is he says, "It is that, and it is this." And in that way, tava dāsaḥ aham, Madhvācārya says, "I am your slave." Tava dāsaḥ aham, tava dāso 'ham. But Śaṅkarācārya says, "No. Ātmā itself is Paramātmā. There is no question of his saying, tava dāso 'ham." Like that, jagan mithyā, brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā. And then we see, as propounded by Śaṅkarācārya, as explained by Śaṅkarācārya, the same it is said by Madhvācārya as jagat satyam and brahma satyam: "Both are satya." And when Śaṅkarācārya says that jagan mithyā brahma satyam, the same Brahma-sūtra, it is taken up by Madhvācārya in a different way. He says jagan mithyā, er, I'm sorry, jagat satyam and brahma satyam. And Rāmānuja says in a different way again, most confusing, he says, "At some stage it is realistic, and at a different stage it becomes unrealistic." So, in so many factors, I find that there are so many contradictions there. If you kindly clarify the matter in a very clear and straightforward manner, I will be and people will be much obliged to you. So Swāmījī will have to say something about this, whether the world is temporary or whether the world is unrealistic or not, or is it realistic. And if it is realistic, why Śaṅkarācārya has said that it is mithyā, and Rāmānujācārya says, "At one stage it is realistic, and after some stage it becomes unrealistic"? (applause) And therefore I want clarification so that I can understand.

Prabhupāda: The Śaṅkarācārya is accepted as Māyāvādī, because these Māyāvādī philosophers, they think everything is māyā; even Kṛṣṇa is māyā. So our Caitanya Mahāprabhu. . . We belong to Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu belongs to Madhvācārya-sampradāya. As I have already explained, there are mahājanas. So all mahājanas, they have got different sampradāyas. Just like Lord Brahmā, he has got his sampradāya; it is called Brahma-sampradāya. Similarly, Lord Śiva has his sampradāya; it is called Rudra-sampradāya. Lakṣmījī has got his (her) sampradāya; it is called Śrī-sampradāya. So śāstra says that śrutayo vibhinnaḥ. You hear different types of philosophy from different sources. Na cāsāv munir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam. One cannot be accepted as a great saintly person unless he puts forward his own theory. Therefore, mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). We have to accept the mahājana.

Now, apart from accepting mahājana, we have to use our senses also. Of course, unless we are advanced in our sensual speculation, that is also not possible. But one common sense is: is brahma-satya, how jagat can be mithyā? It is a common sense. The brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā. . . This jagat is created by Brahman. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Brahman means. . . What is that Brahman? The original source of everything. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Why jagat should be mithyā? Huh? Suppose somebody has created this microphone with hard labor, and if I say, "This is all mithyā," is it very good thing? If Kṛṣṇa has created. . .

ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo
mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate
iti matvā bhajante māṁ
budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ
(BG 10.8)

Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ. Kṛṣṇa says that "I am the origin of everything," the same answer. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Who is that person from whom everything has come into existence? So if Kṛṣṇa is fact, Brahman, then He says, ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ, "I am the origin of everything," how other things can be false? No. We do not accept this philosophy. If Kṛṣṇa is truth, then this world is also truth. It may be temporary—bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19)—but it is not untruth. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu therefore has criticized Śaṅkarācārya, māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169): "If you accept Māyāvāda philosophy, then your progress is doomed, finished." This is the. . .

So we are follower of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. We do not accept this Śaṅkara's philosophy, that the world is mithyā. No. It is fact. It is fact. Because unless it. . . But the vision is different. Vision is different. That is called māyā. What is the fact? The fact: this world is created by Kṛṣṇa, or God; therefore it is God's property. But we are thinking our property. That is false. That is the meaning of Śaṅkarācārya's. . . that you are thinking that it is your country. No. It is Kṛṣṇa's country. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. Why you are falsely claiming your, and fighting yourself? This is false. Not the world is false, but the acceptance of the world falsely, that is false. Not the world is false. That is fact.

So we must have common sense to understand, and, I mean to say, understand through other sources also. As Madhvācārya says, "No, jagat satyam," that is fact. How you can say this jagat is false? It is not false. Besides that, that Vyāsadeva, he's the compiler of Vedānta-sūtra, and he has commented himself about Vedānta-sūtra. That is Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Bhāṣyaṁ brahma-sūtrāṇām. And at the end of each chapter of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, you'll find, brahma-sūtrasya bhāṣya. So when the author is giving a commentary personally, we should accept that. Why others? So Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is the natural commentary given by Vyāsadeva. We should accept. And it begins. . . Because it is commentary on Brahma-sūtra, therefore it begins with the sūtra, Brahma-sūtra, janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataś ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ svarāṭ (SB 1.1.1). This is the explanation. So the conclusion is that we Vaiṣṇavas, we do not say that this jagat is mithyā. No. The jagat is satya. Unless the jagat is satya, how we are approaching God, the Absolute Truth, through this material, I mean to say, world? How it is possible? You cannot approach the truth through false thing. That is not possible. Therefore our Gosvāmīs' conclusion is that,

prāpañcikatayā buddhyā
mumukṣubhiḥ parityāgo
phalgu vairāgyaṁ kathyate
(Brs 1.2.256)

This is the given. . . definition given by Śrī Rūpa Gosvāmī. The prāpañcikatayā buddhyā. . . This world is material; therefore it is false. So. . . But hari-sambandhi-vastunaḥ. But it has got connection with Hari. Hari has created. Kṛṣṇa has created. How? It is not without. . . how you can say, "without any relationship"? If I have created something, it has got. . . I have got intimate relationship. Therefore the Rūpa Gosvāmī says that "Any creation of the Lord, if we think it is material," prāpañcikatayā buddhyā hari-sambandhi, mumukṣubhiḥ parityāgaḥ. . . Those who are. . . Because these Māyāvādīs, they are after mumukṣā, so mumukṣubhiḥ parityāgaḥ, if they are giving up, then phalgu-vairāgya. It is called phalgu-vairāgya, false renunciation. The world is not false, but the so-called renunciation is false. But the real fact is. . . Rūpa Gosvāmī says that,

anāsaktasya viṣayān
yathārham upayuñjataḥ
nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe
yuktaṁ vairāgyam ucyate
(Brs 1.2.255)

Anāsaktasya viṣayān. We are after sense enjoyment. That is called viṣaya. Viṣaya means the object of sense gratification. So we should not be very much eager to enjoy. God's creation should be engaged for God's enjoyment, not for my enjoyment. If we are trained up in this way, anāsaktasya viṣayān, we can take prasādam. We have to eat also. But if we think that "These things are made for me. I have to eat," then that is mithyā. "This is given by God, given by Kṛṣṇa, so let me offer it to Kṛṣṇa: 'Kṛṣṇa, it is Your thing. You first of all taste, then I'll take it.' " Anāsaktasya viṣayān yathārham upayuñjataḥ. "As it is. But Your thing should be offered to You, and then I shall take." That is yukta-vairāgya.

There are many other things that this kind of false identification. . . So many Māyāvādīs, they first of all say, brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā, but after few days, again they come to this jagat and become interested in so-called material service, because he could not realize Brahman. That is explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanty adho 'nādṛta-yuṣmad-aṅghrayaḥ (SB 10.2.32). They may rise up to the paraṁ padam, brahma-pada, but anādṛta-yuṣmad-aṅghrayaḥ, because they could not take up the service of the lotus feet of the Lord, they fall down. There are many instances, many sannyāsīs, they give up this world as mithyā and again come to politics, again come to philanthropic work. Why? If jagat is mithyā, why you are coming to politics and philanthropic work? That is āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanty adhaḥ (SB 10.2.32). Again they fall down.

So there are many controversial points. It may take long hours. But so far we are, Vaiṣṇava, are concerned, we don't accept that this world is false. No. Everything is meant for Kṛṣṇa's service. Kṛṣṇa says, bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). He is the proprietor. And He is the bhoktā. So don't try to enjoy this world. That is false. Everything engaged for Kṛṣṇa's—that is reality. So jagat is not unreal. Our attitude, our mentality, is unreal, that "The whole world is for my enjoyment." No. The creator says, bhoktā aham: "I am enjoyer." Why you are claiming you are enjoyer? That is your false claim. So jagat is not false, but our claim to enjoy the jagat, that is false. So we have to convert it, that it is enjoyable by Kṛṣṇa. Then you come to reality.

Thank you very much. (applause) (break)

All the poverty-stricken people may come to us. We shall supply prasādam. (applause) That is the solution. Come on. We shall supply you.

Acyutānanda: (reading question) "After physical death, the soul will take birth as per the saṁskāras, or past deeds. So what made the soul take birth in the very beginning?"

Prabhupāda: What is that? Very beginning?

Acyutānanda: "After the physical death of the body, the soul will take birth as per the past deeds."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Acyutānanda: "So what made the soul take birth in the first place?"

Prabhupāda: In the first place?

Acyutānanda: What is the first birth? What is the cause of the first birth?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is stated in the Prema-vivarta:

kṛṣṇa bhuliya jīva bhoga vañcha kare
pāśate māyā tāre jāpaṭiyā dhare

As soon as. . . We are eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa. As soon as we want to become master, that is the beginning of our first birth in the material world. We have got independence. Because, Kṛṣṇa says, mamaivāṁśo jīva bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7)—we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa—so Kṛṣṇa has got full independence, but we are minute; therefore we have got minute independence. Our business is to serve Kṛṣṇa, but as soon as we give up this idea, we want to become master. That is the beginning of our material birth.

Acyutānanda: This question says, "India is the motherland for Kṛṣṇa cult and needs no propaganda. You'll be doing more service for the Kṛṣṇa cult if you demonstrate against America for helping Christian missionaries in India. Please enlighten me."

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is for everyone. Kṛṣṇa never says, "I am for Indian" or "for American." Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya. (applause)

sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
sambhavanti mūrtayaḥ yāḥ
tāsāṁ mahad yonir brahma
ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
(BG 14.4)

Kṛṣṇa is father of all living entities in any form of life, not only human, but the cats, dogs and everyone. He is the father of all living entities.

Acyutānanda: "Why doesn't the Kṛṣṇa conscious movement stop cow slaughter? Five thousand cows are slaughtered daily. Why?"

Prabhupāda: Then? Why?

Acyutānanda: Cows are slaughtered. (aside:) Who put this question?

Prabhupāda: You are killing cows? Or what is that?

Guest (2): Why doesn't the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement stop cow slaughter? Every day five thousand cows are being slaughtered.

Prabhupāda: Yes, we are teaching don't eat meat. So "don't eat meat" means don't slaughter cows and goats and everyone. You are after stopping cow slaughter, but you are advocating goat slaughter. But we are not for any slaughter. Don't eat meat, that's all.

Acyutānanda: There's one question: "If everyone becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, then how will they make a living?"

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa says, yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham (BG 9.22). He is. . . Eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). He's supplying everyone. So we have got ten thousand disciples all over the world. Mostly they are Europeans and Americans and Australians. Their expenditure is very heavy. How Kṛṣṇa is supplying, you can see. We are spending ten lakhs of rupees per month, and Kṛṣṇa is supplying.

Acyutānanda: "Did you ever see the lotus Lord or feel His presence?"

Prabhupāda: Hmm? What is that?

Devotee: Do you ever feel Kṛṣṇa's presence, or see Him?

Prabhupāda: Yes, you can feel also. Premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti. This is the formula of seeing Kṛṣṇa:

santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti
yaṁ śyāmasundaram acintya-guṇa-svarūpaṁ
govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi
(Bs. 5.38)

If you have developed your love of Kṛṣṇa, then you'll see Him twenty-four hours. Just like you, if you love somebody, you'll always think of him. That is natural. So the first qualification is whether you have developed that love for Kṛṣṇa. Then you'll see twenty-four hours.

Acyutānanda: "What is the easiest method of attaining mokṣa while in family life?"

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Haṁsadūta: (repeats question)

Prabhupāda: That is not recommended in the Vedic śāstra. (laughter) Especially Śaṅkarācārya, he would not accept anyone unless he accepts sannyāsa. He never accepts anybody.

Acyutānanda: "There are many religious movements. How does Kṛṣṇa consciousness take priority?"

Devotee: There are many religious movements. Why is this the topmost?

Prabhupāda: Because it is Kṛṣṇa's movement. He is the topmost. Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). Kṛṣṇa says, "There is no more superior truth than Me." Therefore Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the supreme truth. There is no more superior truth than Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Acyutānanda: "When a person dies, his soul will take another body. Then why is the population today increasing?"

Prabhupāda: Because they are blocked-up, bottle-necked. They are not going back to home, back to Godhead. Therefore it is crowded. (laughter)

Acyutānanda: "Why does Kṛṣṇa allow us to commit mistakes and later punishes us?"

Prabhupāda: That is His mercy. You want to do something bad. Kṛṣṇa says, "Don't do it." But if you want to do it at your risk, Kṛṣṇa allows, "All right, do it, and suffer yourself." Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). He does not say anything. But if you want to do something else, do it at your risk.

That's all right. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda. (end).