701225 - Lecture SB 06.01.44 - Surat

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His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

701225SB-SURAT - December 25, 1970 - 58:11 Minutes

Prabhupāda: You can open that door. You are feeling cold by opening the door?

Haṁsadūta: No. No, I'm fine.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. Naturally it is cold, you can close that door. (break)

sambhavanti hi bhadrāṇi
viparītāni cānaghāḥ
kāriṇāṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sti
dehavān na hy akarma-kṛt
(SB 6.1.44)

Dehavān. Dehavān means the living entities who have accepted this material body. Dehavān. Vān, there is a Sanskrit verb, vatup, asty arthe vatup. When one possesses something, it is called vatup-pratyāya, and from vatup it becomes vān. Dehavān means "one who possesses this material world." Just like there are many other, bhagavān, gunavān—vān means "possesses." Similarly, here also the same word is used, vān, dehavān. So the Yamadūta says that anyone who accepted this material body, he has to work. He has to work.

There are three kinds of energies of God: viṣṇu-śaktiḥ parā proktā (CC Madhya 6.154). Actually, the Lord's energy is spiritual, spiritual energy. Viṣṇu-śaktiḥ parā proktā. And these living entities, they are also parā. Kṣetra-jñākhyā tathā parā—there is another śakti, kṣetrajña. The kṣetrajña-śakti means we living entities, we are also energy of Kṛṣṇa, of God. We are known as kṣetrajña-śakti. Kṣetrajña-śakti means I know about my body; the pains and pleasure of my body I can understand. Therefore I am living . . . living entity.

The non-living entities . . . a stone cannot understand the pains and pleasures, because there is no life. But as soon as there is life, the pains and pleasures are felt. The dead body cannot feel pains and pleasure. But kṣetra-jñākhyā tathā parā. As the direct energy of Kṛṣṇa, or God, is spiritual, similarly the living entities, they are also of the same nature. Therefore God and the living entities are one, because of the same nature, parā.

Tṛtīya-śaktīr anyā. Another . . . there is another śakti, tathā-para, tṛtīya-śaktīr karma-saṅga. Another śakti, the spiritual śakti, spiritual energy, is one, and the material energy, there you have to work. Tṛtīya karma-saṅga anya. There is another energy, where you have to work; otherwise there is no . . . you have to work, anyone who has got this body, material body.

Just like an ant and an elephant, both have got this material body, but none of them can sit idly. The ant requires a grain of sugar, and the elephant requires three hundred mounds for eating at a time. Huge quantity. But both of them have to work. The ant cannot say: "Oh, I require only a little grain." The lion, he has to also work. He cannot say, "I am lion." Just like our Lions members, Lion Club, they like lion, as if they haven't got to work, or . . .

So, nahi suptasya siṁhasya praviśyanti mukhe mṛgāḥ (Hitopadeśa). One lion thought—there is a story—that, "I am the king of the animals, so I shall sleep, and I shall order all the animals to come, and I shall eat." So he lied down for several days; no animal came, and he was starving. Therefore he had to work; he had to find out his prey.

Actually, the lions and tigers, they do not find every day their prey. That is another miserable condition. They are very powerful, but they have very little chance of showing their power. So unless some animal comes, what is the use of power? The animals . . . every animal is careful. No one is going to the forest where tiger and lions are there. Everyone takes care. So animals also. But when they are too much starving, Kṛṣṇa gives them food, "All right you can kill this animal." They cannot get every day. Neither they can get food by sleeping, "I will not work." No, that is not. Nahi suptasya siṁhasya praviśyanti mukhe mṛgāḥ—a Hitopadeśa story.

So here in this material world you cannot cease working. You have to work. Kṛṣṇa also says to Arjuna that "You cannot live even without working." So you have to work. Foolish people say that Vaiṣṇavas, they do not work. They work. They work simply for Kṛṣṇa, day and night. Twenty-four hours they work. They are not idle sleepers. So in this material world, you have to work. But if you work for Kṛṣṇa, that is dharma. And if you do not work for Kṛṣṇa, that is adharma. That's all.

Therefore Kṛṣṇa says:

sarva-dharmān parityajya
mām ekaṁśaraṇaṁ vraja
(BG 18.66)

"You simply work for Me." That is life. Is there any counterarguments against this logic? You have to work, but if you work for Kṛṣṇa, then you are saved. If you work for your sense gratification, you'll become entangled—one after another, one after another, one after another. Then you cannot get out of these clutches of repeated birth and death. You have to continue sense gratification—sometimes a man, sometimes a demigod, sometimes an animal, sometimes a tree, sometime an insect, sometime a bird, sometime an aquatic, sometime this planet, sometimes another planet.

There are innumerable planets, varieties of planets, and innumerable varieties of living entities in this material world, and they are rotating here, there, here, there, here, there. But under the spell of māyā, when one gets a particular type of body, he identities himself that, "I am this body"— "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am this," "I am that," "I am that"—and he becomes entangled in that business and simply spoils his life under this impression, false impression, false egotism.

Caitanya Mahaprabhu clearly says, jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa dāsa (CC Madhya 20.108). The actual constitutional position of the living entity is that he's eternal servant, eternal servant of God. If he takes that position, then he's safe; otherwise he's not.

So in order to be elevated to this position there are different stages. The first stage is karma. Tṛtīya karma-saṅga anya tṛtīya śaktir iṣyate (CC Madhya 6.154). The material energy . . . those who are in the modes of ignorance, just like animals, they have no other information, neither they can understand what he is. There is no possibility in the animal life of understanding what I am. That is not possible. Therefore we should utilize this human form of life to understand what I am.

When Sanātana Gosvāmī approached Lord Caitanya to become His disciple, he surrendered himself and said: "My dear Lord, I was minister, and people used to address me as a learned man. And I accepted them that, 'I am very learned man. I am very intelligent man.' But actually, I am neither learned, neither intelligent, because I do not know what I am. This is my learning. I know everything except what I am." That's all.

The modern education is like that. He'll talk of everything, but if you ask him, "What you are?" oh, there is no answer. There is no answer. Grāmya-vyavahāre kaha e paṇḍita, sākṣa kare māni (CC Madhya 20.100). Sanātana Gosvāmī says that "These foolish neighbors, they call me very learned man, and I also become self-complacent. I think, 'Oh, I am. I am learned.' "

People say, "You are B.A.," "You are M.A.," "You are Ph.D.," and I think "Yes, I am very learned man." But if a Ph.D. man is asked, "Can you kindly explain what you are, what is your necessity?" he will simply say about this body, "I am Indian," "I am this," "I am Hindu," "I am a man," "I am woman." That means he can simply give his identification of this body, which he is not. Therefore he is fool number one. He is giving identification—this is called pramāṇa.

Arjuna was thinking in that term, "Kṛṣṇa, how can I fight? On the other side there are my cousin-brother and his sons; they are my nephews. And my cousin-brother's brother-in-law, all are there. And if I kill my cousin-brothers, then their wives will be widows, and they will be polluted, and there will be unwanted children . . ." So many things he was explaining as a very learned man. Very learned man.

So when he was puzzled, he was answering in his own way. But he was puzzled. At that time he said, "Kṛṣṇa, I am now actually puzzled. Actually, I am ksatriya, it is my duty to fight. But I am deviating from that duty. So I know that this is my fault, but I am puzzled. I cannot clear up what to do. And I know that you can explain what is my duty. Therefore I surrender unto You as Your disciple." Śiṣyas te 'haṁśādhi māṁ prapannam (BG 2.7): "I surrender unto You. Please instruct me what is to be done."

This is the position everyone. Everyone is puzzled. Nobody knows what is actual duty, what is the actual position. Therefore the Bhāgavat says, tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta: when one is actually inquisitive to understand his position, that inquisitiveness is the qualification for approaching a spiritual master. Otherwise there is no need of having a spiritual master for the showbottle. There is no need of spiritual . . .

Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥśreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One who is actually serious to understand about himself, he requires a spiritual master. Otherwise, why he makes show: "Oh, so many people have got spiritual masters, just like so many people maintain dogs, I will have to maintain a dog." Not like that.

You must find out seriously a spiritual master who can solve the problems of your life. Saṁsāra dāvānala-līḍha-loka-trāṇāya (Śrī Śrī Gurv-aṣṭaka), that is the first line. Everyone is suffering in the blazing fire of this material existence. And if he is serious to get out of it, he must approach a bona fide spiritual master. That is the injunction of the Veda.

So this material existence, you have to work. And you have to work means you have to work pious or impious. There are two things—dharma and adharma, lawful or illegal. Therefore the Vedas are there. How you can work lawfully without? You cannot work unlawfully. Just like in the state, in any circumstances you cannot work unlawfully. Then you'll be arrested.

Why don't you believe in the God's kingdom? The atheists, they take up the position of God, because if they accept that there is God, then all their sinful activities have to be explained, and they are afraid of that. Therefore, just like sometimes the . . . what is it called? The ja . . . I forget the name. There is one animal; just now I am forgetting.

Devotee: . . . (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: They are found in the bushes?

Devotee: Jackal?

Woman Devotee: Rabbit?

Prabhupāda: Rabbit. Rabbit.

Guest: White rabbit.

Prabhupāda: So the rabbit, when some animal comes to attack, he closes his eyes, (laughter) as if there is no danger. Yes. And the animal is very easily captured. You see? And all the animals. Even the monkeys, they also sometimes drop from the tree, and then there is another ferocious animal—close the eyes.

So this atheistic class of men, they, by closing their eyes, they try to forget, "There is no God. I am God." But that will not save them. God's action will be there. They may think like that: "There is no God. I am closing my eyes. I don't care for God."

Just like government . . . some foolish persons, and we have actually seen it. Gandhi inaugurated the civil disobedience movement. So out of enthusiasm, 60,000 Indians, they went to . . . because Gandhi said jail was svaraj ka mandir hai: "If you accept jail, then that is the opening for . . . you are successful." But some of my friends also went to jail, civil disobedience, and there was one friend, I asked him, "What is your condition?"

Actually, many gentlemen died after coming back from that civil disobedience jail. C. R. Das died; many. They . . . slow poison, and beaten like anything. They know how to govern that they may not come again in this jail. So many people died, and they suffered. And so I asked one of my friends, "So whether you are going again to jail?" He said, "No, no. I am not going." You see?

So similarly, we may defy the existence of God, "There is no God. I don't care for God. There is no law. I am everything, so 'haṁ," but that closing will not do. God has many agents. As soon as you do something wrong, immediately there is punishment. There is punishment.

So you have to work. Avidya-karma-samjñānya trtiya śaktir isyate (CC Madhya 6.154). So long we are in the material . . . under the spell of this material energy, you have to work. And because you have to work, some work may be very good, some work must be some bad. That is natural. So a devotee says, therefore, kāmādināṁ kati na katidhā pālitā durnideṣaḥ (CC Madhya 22.16):

"My dear Lord, actually I am Your servant, but because I wanted to be master, therefore I became servant of so many masters."

One master is lust: I am the servant of lust. Kāmādināṁ. The first servant is kama, lust. Therefore for spiritual life one has to stop this lusty desires: brahmacārī, sannyāsī, restricted household life. Because the lust is the basic principle of this, ah, yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tucchaṁ (SB 7.9.45). There are many instances.

So we are servant of lust, servants of anger. Kāmādināṁ. The lust is the first, ādi. Then when lust is not fulfilled, then we become angry. Just like a child, he wants something; if you don't give it then he becomes angry and cries. So one after another—lust, anger, greediness, so many. Kāmādināṁ. So we become, in the name of becoming God, becoming independent, we become servant of these propensities. That's all. Kāmādināṁ.

And they dictate us, "You do. Never mind there is risk, you do it." Durnideśāḥ. Durnideśāḥ means just like I am a servant in a firm, and he is black-marketing, and the master orders me "You must do this business, black market." That is illegal, but because my master asks me, I have to do it. This is called durnideśāḥ. Durnideśāḥ.

So lust . . . of course, there is arrangement for fulfilling your lust. God has arranged everything. You are very much anxious to satisfy your senses, so there is arrangement that you satisfy your senses. You legally accept a wife or you legally accept a husband and satisfy your senses and be Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is the law.

But if one becomes so much lusty that he does not take responsibility of accepting a wife or husband—he fulfills his desires in some other way—that entangles him. This is going on. Lust. So first thing is the illicit order of the lust, "Why not? Why should you restrict yourself in one wife? Why not have a thousand friends and go on satisfying your senses?" This is called durnideśāḥ. The lust is dictating him.

So when one comes to the senses, he says: "My Lord, I wanted to be master, but I became servant of all these propensities." Kāmādināṁ. "Not only I became servant, but I executed their orders, illegal orders." Kāmādīnāṁ kati na katidhā pālitā durnideśāḥ (CC Madhya 22.16). "But now I see that still, they are not satisfied. I have served the lust so faithfully that I carried things which is not to be done; still the lust is not satisfied."

Teṣāṁ na karuṇā jatā. "And I have worked for them so faithfully, still they are not happy, they are not pleased. They're not kind upon me: still ordering, still ordering, still ordering." Kāmādīnāṁ kati na katidhā pālitā durnideśāḥ, teṣāṁ na mayi karuṇā na jatā. "They're not kind enough. They do not think that, 'This rascal has worked blindly on my dictation; now let him go, let him take rest.' 'No, you must work.' " This is the position.

Teṣāṁ na mayi karuṇā na jatā na trapā. "All right, if . . . they are not kind. But if I ask, 'Are you satisfied with my service?' 'No.' " Na trapā. " 'Are you now peaceful?' 'No.' " Nopaśāntiḥ. " 'Will you stop dictating me any more?' 'No. So long you live, I must dictate.' " This is our position. And people . . . this is called illusion, māyā. He's trying to be master, but he is becoming more and more servant of these six propensities.

Manaḥ-ṣaṣṭhāni indriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati, in the Bhagavad-gītā (15.7). Under mental speculation, being servant of lust, greediness, anger, they are struggling hard in this material world. Prakṛti-sthāni karṣati. Mamaiv . . . "But they are actually My parts and parcels," mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7) . . . ah

Devotee: Jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Ah. Sanātanaḥ, eternal. But they have taken to this business. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is so kind, He comes personally, "You rascal, you give up all this nonsense. Surrender unto Me—I will give you protection." But the rascal will not agree. Just like the hog, when Brahmā said, "You are Indra. You have been cursed to become a hog.

Now whatever is done is done, now I've come to take you. Please come." "No, sir. I cannot go. I cannot leave my responsibilities. I have got so many responsibilities." "Are you a hog? You are suffering. And this is not your life—you are Indra. Come on." "No, no. I don't want Indra. I don't want to be Indra. I want to remain a hog." "All right, remain."

Similarly, Kṛṣṇa comes to claim you, reclaim you: sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁśaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). "No, Sir, I will not come. This is not possible. I'll remain a hog." "All right, remain a hog." What Kṛṣṇa can do? And what Kṛṣṇa's father can do? Unless you agree to surrender, you will be allowed, "All right, you go on with your business." That is required. The first proposition, the first condition, is that you must agree to surrender.

That is the whole teachings of Bhagavad-gītā. We should stop all this nonsense, benevolent work, "I am nationalist," "I am socialist," "I am this," "I am that." You can go on with that work, but so long you do not agree to be Kṛṣṇa-ized, or Kṛṣṇa conscious, your this position of repeated birth and death under different condition of life will continue.

So the karmīs position is so precarious. And there are . . . when one is disgusted with this karmīs position, just like this devotee says, that "I have served so long, Sir, but they are not satisfied. They are not satisfied, and I have become fed up. Now I have come to You, Sir. Please engage me in Your service." That is Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hare means "O my . . . the energy of Kṛṣṇa," and Kṛṣṇa means "O Kṛṣṇa." This is addressing: "O energy," or "Energy . . ."

Because just like this material energy, we have to . . . we are energy; we have to be under other energy. Just like there are different departments of government. They are different energies. So one energy is under some energy, another energy is under some energy. Similarly, we are marginal energy, tathasta śakti. Tathasta śakti.

So we have to live either under the spiritual energy or under this material energy. That is our choice. Just like you have made a choice to come here, that you are agreeing to come under spiritual energy. But there are many who may not come. They do not agree to come under the spiritual energy.

So God does not interfere, "You may remain wherever you like." But because we have got this living condition, we have got this discriminating power what to do, and therefore sat-saṅga is required to come to our senses. Just like naughty children are sent to school to become pacified and to learn. Similarly, this sat-saṅga is required.

That was India's civilization. In every village, in every town, there was arrangement for sat-saṅga, and the Brahmins, they were meant for, I mean to say, disseminating this Vedic knowledge. And people used to take knowledge. The kṣatriyas, the vaiśyas, they used to take knowledge from these learned Brahmins; they used to act accordingly.

Therefore they were happy. Now they have left everything. Everything has be . . . everyone has become God, and they can defy any Vedic rules, and they can eat any nonsense, like hogs. And a svāmī will say, "Yes, there is no . . . (indistinct) . . . of your religion; simply meditate that you are God, then everything is finished."

But that is not the actual position. You have to hear.

satāṁ prasaṅgān mama vīrya-saṁvido
bhavanti hṛt-karṇa-rasāyanāḥ kathāḥ
(SB 3.25.25)

You have to hear from the right source. Therefore Vedic literature is called śruti, "by hearing." Śravaṇaṁ.

śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ
smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam
arcanaṁ vandanaṁ dāsyaṁ
sakhyam ātma-nivedanam
(SB 7.5.23)

These are the rules and regulations. Everything is there. If you kindly accept this authority, then your life is successful. Otherwise, kāmādīnāṁ kati na katidhā pālitā durnideśāḥ—be satisfied with sense gratification like dogs and hogs, and repeated birth and death and so on. This is not threatening; this is actually the fact. But unfortunately we do not try to understand these things. That is our misfortune.

Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (devotees offer obeisances) (break)

Guest (Indian man): I am telling that, you told a very good support of having a good and extraordinary life.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Guest: But I am thinking that . . . (indistinct) . . . that he's not aware of that, so he's . . . (indistinct) . . . now there is no way of, of preparing for . . . (indistinct) . . . "I'm going there. Don't worry."

Prabhupāda: That is foolishness. You see? That is foolishness. Why should you surrender in that way? That is . . . in human life, one does not go to the tiger and "Please eat me." No. He takes precaution. If you have got precautionary measures, why shouldn't you accept it? Kṛṣṇa says:

mām eva ye prapadyante
māyām etāṁ taranti te
(BG 7.14)

You are saved from all the reactions of this māyā simply by surrendering to Kṛṣṇa. Why don't you accept this? Why do you say that "All right. Please, kindly, Mr. Tiger, I have no other way. Please eat me." Philanthropic? That's not very good idea. When there is precautionary measures, why don't you accept it? You can save yourself.

Guest: God has made several times . . .

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guest: God has made several times. He said . . . (indistinct)

Prabhupāda:? God has not made; you have made.

Guest: (indistinct) . . . knowledge from . . . (indistinct) . . . We can know that.

Prabhupāda: That is nature's way, nature's way. This is called sad-vikāra. This is nature's law. You cannot avoid it. This is called apakṣaya, apakṣaya, dwindling. Anything, it remain fresh. Just like flower, from the bud it grows, and then it fructifies and becomes very beautiful. Then there are some seeds, everything . . . then it becomes dry, withered, and then finish. This is law, applicable to every . . . anything material, this law is applicable. Anything material.

But when you, ah, under spirit, when you go to the spiritual world, these things are not there. That is eternal. So if you have got chance for being promoted to such eternal life, why not try in this human form of life for that eternal life. Kṛṣṇa says:

yad gatvā na nivartante
tad dhāma paramaṁ mama
(BG 15.6)
mām upetya kaunteya
duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam
nāpnuvanti mahātmānaḥ
saṁsiddhiṁ paramāṁ gatāḥ
(BG 8.15)

Why don't you accept this? The things are there. The measures are there. Just like there are schools, there are colleges—it is open for education. If you don't take education, then that is up to you. So these books are there. Anādi bahirmukha jīva kṛṣṇa bhuli gela (CC Madhya 20.117). We have forgotten Kṛṣṇa. We do not know from where it began. But it is a fact that we have forgotten Kṛṣṇa. Now try to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. This is the opportunity.

Guest (2) (Indian man): Which is the correct way for one who wants to get himself liberated from the bondage of lust, when he is Grhastha?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (2): Because one may not be doing physically anything, but mentally everybody is doing something in one thing or another.

Prabhupad: Yes. That I explained, that you have to work. You cannot avoid work. But if you work for Kṛṣṇa, you are saved. A simple thing.

Guest (2): Yes, that is also . . . (indistinct) . . . by worshiping.

Prabhupāda: Well, when you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, what Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā, you have to do that. That's all. Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to apply practically in life the instruction of Kṛṣṇa. That's all. Why don't you do that? Is there any difficulty?

Guest (2): Yes, it is really very difficult.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Guest (2): It is really very difficult!

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is difficult . . . so long . . . so long you are rebellious it is difficult. "Why shall I surrender to Kṛṣṇa?" That is the difficulty. Otherwise it is second's business. You try, immediately surrender to Kṛṣṇa, He takes charge of you. He says, ahaṁ tvāṁ pariksyāmi sarva-pāpe . . . (BG 18.66). But you won't do. That is your determination: "Why should I surrender to Kṛṣṇa?" All right. Don't do it. He gives you guarantee that "I take charge of you." Why don't you surrender? Say it—what is your objection?

Guest (2): There is no objection to it.

Prabhupāda: Then why don't you do it?

Guest (2): I am doing it, but it is very difficult.

Prabhupāda: Why difficult? So many others are doing. What is the difficulty? They are in a different culture, different society. They are doing. And what is your difficulty?

Guest (2): Because these people, they have left the material world, and they have become . . .

Prabhupāda: They have not left . . . all these girls, they've got their husbands. Here is husband and wife sitting. What do you mean by "material world"? Eating, sleeping, mating and defending—this is material life. So are they not eating? They're starving? Are they not sleeping? Are they not mating? The wife is there. What do you mean by material life?

These four things, but they are Kṛṣṇa conscious, that is the difference. Simply they have accepted Kṛṣṇa as life; otherwise nothing is denied to them. It is not that they are eating . . . they are not eating, they are not sleeping, they are not mating, they are not defending, they have become all fools and rascals. No.

Don't misunderstand that Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to avoid everything. Why? You have to work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that's all. Otherwise nothing is denied. So it is our obstinacy that we do not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Otherwise there is no difficulty. "I shall not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness"—that is the defect.

So this can be avoided if you attend. Just like all these boys, they were also like that, but attending these lectures, lectures, lectures, one day they "Sir, I shall become . . ." Like that. That is the way. Therefore sat-saṅga is required. In the beginning it appears very difficult, but if you associate with devotees, this māyā, this false idea, will be . . .

Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and these difficulties will be over. Simple method. If you feel difficulty, go on chanting constantly, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa. And all difficulties will be avoided.

Devotee: What does this word sat-saṅga mean?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee: What does that word sat-saṅga mean?

Haṁsadūta: Sat-saṅga.

Prabhupāda: Sat-saṅga. Sat-saṅga, you do not know this word? Sat-saṅga means to associate with devotees. That's all. There are sat-saṅga and asat-saṅga. If you associate with devotees, then your path of liberation is clear. And if you associate with materialists, then your path of darkness is open. That's all. There are two paths. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes (SB 5.5.2). Mahat-sevā.

When you engage yourself in the service of mahat . . . Mahat means those who are . . . one who is surrendered, this, Kṛṣṇa has said surrender. As soon as you surrender, you become a mahat. And one who serves the mahat, mahat-sevā, for him, dvāram āhur vimuktes. Then his path of, path of liberation becomes open.

Tamo-dvāraṁ yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam. And if you associate yoṣit—yoṣit means sense gratificatory agent. Generally, yoṣit is understood as women, but not . . . that is limited. Anything sense gratification, that is called yoṣit. Yoṣit saṅgi-saṅgam. If you associate with persons . . . those who are too much addicted to sense gratification, then you're tamo-dvāraṁ. You must know that you are making progress to the darkness. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes.

So you have to . . . these things are there. We have to simply learn. Just like a boy, uneducated, when he goes to the school everything becomes clear. He becomes M.A., Ph.D. That's all. So we have got this advantage. In our India especially, so many literatures, they are available, but we are not taking advantage of them. They are misguided. To take birth on the land of Bhārata-varṣa is a great opportunity. But we are not taking advantage. Neither there is encouragement from the government side, from the parents' side, so-called spiritual master. So our position is very precarious.

Guest: Swāmījī, (Hindi).

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Guest: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Hah. Karmāṇi nirdahati kintu ca bhakti-bhājāṁ (Bs. 5.54). (Hindi) Beginning from Indra, the king of heaven, down to the indra germ . . . there is a small germ which is called indra-gopa, very small. In the Brahma-saṁhitā it is said,

yas tv indragopam athavendram aho sva-karma-
bandhānurūpa-phala-bhājanam ātanoti
(Bs. 5.54)

Beginning from that big Indra down to this small indra, everyone is bound up by the reaction of his own work. Karmāṇi nirdahati kintu ca bhakti-bhājāṁ. If you take to devotional service, your karma will be immediately curtailed. Why? Kṛṣṇa says, "Never mind you are bound up by karma. You take shelter upon Me, I'll give you protection." When Kṛṣṇa gives you protection, assures you, why you are fearing the karma-bāṇḍa?

Guest: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Those who are attached to these fruitive activities, for them, not for the devotees. Don't you see? These Europeans, Americans, how much abominable life was there. Now see. Because they have taken to devotional service, immediately changed—everything. That assurance is there, the śāstra is there, the practical result is there. But the only determination is that "I will not take to this path." That is the hindrance. "I will not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness." That is our misfortune. Otherwise, everything is there.

Guest: Prakṛtiṁ yānti bhūtāni nigrahaḥ kiṁ kariṣyati (BG 3.33).

Prabhupāda: Ah. Prakṛti . . . why should you keep in this prakṛti, material prakṛti? There is other prakṛti. Why don't you take the spiritual prakṛti? That you can accept.

When Kṛṣṇa says that, "You come to this side," why don't you come? That is your independence. Just like Kṛṣṇa asks Arjuna that, "Now I have instructed you everything. What you are going to do?" Kṛṣṇa was not certain that, "Arjuna will accept My advice." That independence is there. But he said: "Yes," kariṣye vacanaṁ tava, "I shall accept." That is required.

Guest: Śiṣyas te 'haṁśādhi māṁ tvāṁ prapannam (BG 2.7).

Prabhupāda: Yes. So if you agree, everything is there. If you don't agree, what can be done? Yes?

Guest: (Hindi) The desires are increasing day by day. This is the . . . (indistinct) . . . So what is the best way of controlling that desires and stopping the desires?

Prabhupāda: You have to purify desire. You have to desire only that "I shall serve Kṛṣṇa." That desire. Then all other desires will be purified. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). Sarvopādhi, you are desiring as something else except Kṛṣṇa's servant, and therefore these desires are impure. You haven't to cut down your desires. That is not possible. You cannot be desireless. But you have to purify your desire. That is required.

And that purification of desire can take place when you become freed from the designation. If you designate yourself that, "I am Gujarati," "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am this," "I am that"—that is designation. If you take to your true constitutional position, that "I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa," then immediately all your desires are purified. Tat-paratvena nirmalam. Tat-para. Tat means Kṛṣṇa, and as soon as I take to the side of Kṛṣṇa, everything becomes nirmalam. And unless you are nirmala, you cannot serve Kṛṣṇa. That is not possible.

Devotee: If one engages himself in the service of the pure devotee, then his direction of his energy becomes more purified, the more one serves the pure devotee. I found that this was true. Before I was a devotee I used to come to the temple and do little things—paint here and there, pull a few weeds. Just for an hour every day I would do this, for a week.

Then it became two hours, then it became four hours, then I never went home. I had to stay, because I found that that was like licking on the outside of the bottle of honey, like a bee. But if the jar becomes open, and he can go right in, then what is the need for him going round the outside of the jar? So, the honey is here. Prabhupāda has brought us here. So you coming here once a day, twice a day, so . . . you keep coming.

Guest: . . . (indistinct)

Devotee: That is māyā.

Woman devotee: That is not living . . . (indistinct)

Guest: (indistinct) . . . I told Mahārāja, I want to . . .

Prabhupāda: There is no question of leaving. Why do you say like that? You simply hear. You try to understand what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is no question of leaving.

Guest: (indistinct discussion with other devotees)

Prabhupāda: That is māyā's agent. When the parents see that the . . . "My son is going to a prostitute's house," they, "Well, you are young man." And when he goes to the saintly person, "Oh, this boy's going to be a sannyāsī. Take precaution. Take precaution." (laughs) This is māyā.

They will not object if the boy goes to a prostitute's house, but they'll object if he goes to a sannyāsī. You see? This is māyā. They will overlook, "Ah, what is that? Young man, that's all." As soon as he goes to take instruction from a sadhu-sannyāsī, "Oh, this boy is going to be out of home. Oh, protect him." (chuckles) That is māyā.

Guest: And they are starting to do their own svārtha. They are starting to do their own svārtha. They have got . . .

Prabhupāda: Well, svārtha, here also. Everyone has got. But they do not know. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ (SB 7.5.31). Everyone's svārtha is Visnu. When you concentrate on Kṛṣṇa, that is real svārtha—all these nonsense svartha . . . (break) (end)